https://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?action=history&feed=atom&title=Talk%3ALoyalty_vs._treacheryTalk:Loyalty vs. treachery - Revision history2026-04-27T18:26:59ZRevision history for this page on the wikiMediaWiki 1.43.3https://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304637&oldid=previmported>Ryangibsonstewart: /* AFD */2007-06-13T02:37:08Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD</span></p>
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</table>imported>Ryangibsonstewarthttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=171773&oldid=previmported>Ryangibsonstewart: /* AFD */2007-06-13T02:37:08Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD</span></p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**That being said, my original point on the article was that secrets and deception holds more true to the majority of examples with shifts in loyalty. Niki deceitfully telling Nathan about Linderman's plan behind Jessica's back seems like a stronger example versus her loyalty to Nathan, since her "loyalty" only is shown in one example. The only strong loyalties in the show are Peter to Nathan and Bennet to Claire. The rest of the loyalties seems to taper on and off, which would be a reason for secrets and deception to be the article for this content, where an individual still maintains their loyalty eventually (Claire's loyalty to her father), but it's hampered by secrets and/or deception. This would allow for loyalty to still be illustrated when "Claire's loyalty to her father is put into question when she learns of his involvement with her mother's mental illness". In addition, however, the shifting of many loyalties wouldn't have to be recorded. Matt's loyalty to Bennet, for example, is never fully established. However, his relationship with Bennet is documented in '''Groups''' and this article. My two cents (or bullets).--[[User:Baldbobbo|Bob]] 09:06, 31 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**That being said, my original point on the article was that secrets and deception holds more true to the majority of examples with shifts in loyalty. Niki deceitfully telling Nathan about Linderman's plan behind Jessica's back seems like a stronger example versus her loyalty to Nathan, since her "loyalty" only is shown in one example. The only strong loyalties in the show are Peter to Nathan and Bennet to Claire. The rest of the loyalties seems to taper on and off, which would be a reason for secrets and deception to be the article for this content, where an individual still maintains their loyalty eventually (Claire's loyalty to her father), but it's hampered by secrets and/or deception. This would allow for loyalty to still be illustrated when "Claire's loyalty to her father is put into question when she learns of his involvement with her mother's mental illness". In addition, however, the shifting of many loyalties wouldn't have to be recorded. Matt's loyalty to Bennet, for example, is never fully established. However, his relationship with Bennet is documented in '''Groups''' and this article. My two cents (or bullets).--[[User:Baldbobbo|Bob]] 09:06, 31 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***Everyone for deletion? --{{User:Heroe/sig}} 22:01, 12 June 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>Ryangibsonstewarthttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304636&oldid=previmported>Heroe: /* AFD */2007-06-13T02:01:25Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD</span></p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** We actually have content now, but I just feel like some of the content on the page isn't exactly an example of treachery or loyalty. For example, Nathan sleeping with Niki isn't an example of loyalty as much as it is an example of treachery with his wife. A better example of something for this theme would be Niki's loyalty to Nathan to tell him about Linderman's plan since she seems to like him after their night together at the hotel earlier in the season. Seeing some examples though, I think that we should extend our "deadline" a bit further. I think Ryan's idea of waiting was a good one, and we should give people some time on this. A lot of the themes are stubs, and little is being expanded. Since there's content, however, I think we should hold off. </div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** We actually have content now, but I just feel like some of the content on the page isn't exactly an example of treachery or loyalty. For example, Nathan sleeping with Niki isn't an example of loyalty as much as it is an example of treachery with his wife. A better example of something for this theme would be Niki's loyalty to Nathan to tell him about Linderman's plan since she seems to like him after their night together at the hotel earlier in the season. Seeing some examples though, I think that we should extend our "deadline" a bit further. I think Ryan's idea of waiting was a good one, and we should give people some time on this. A lot of the themes are stubs, and little is being expanded. Since there's content, however, I think we should hold off. </div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**That being said, my original point on the article was that secrets and deception holds more true to the majority of examples with shifts in loyalty. Niki deceitfully telling Nathan about Linderman's plan behind Jessica's back seems like a stronger example versus her loyalty to Nathan, since her "loyalty" only is shown in one example. The only strong loyalties in the show are Peter to Nathan and Bennet to Claire. The rest of the loyalties seems to taper on and off, which would be a reason for secrets and deception to be the article for this content, where an individual still maintains their loyalty eventually (Claire's loyalty to her father), but it's hampered by secrets and/or deception. This would allow for loyalty to still be illustrated when "Claire's loyalty to her father is put into question when she learns of his involvement with her mother's mental illness". In addition, however, the shifting of many loyalties wouldn't have to be recorded. Matt's loyalty to Bennet, for example, is never fully established. However, his relationship with Bennet is documented in '''Groups''' and this article. My two cents (or bullets).--[[User:Baldbobbo|Bob]] 09:06, 31 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**That being said, my original point on the article was that secrets and deception holds more true to the majority of examples with shifts in loyalty. Niki deceitfully telling Nathan about Linderman's plan behind Jessica's back seems like a stronger example versus her loyalty to Nathan, since her "loyalty" only is shown in one example. The only strong loyalties in the show are Peter to Nathan and Bennet to Claire. The rest of the loyalties seems to taper on and off, which would be a reason for secrets and deception to be the article for this content, where an individual still maintains their loyalty eventually (Claire's loyalty to her father), but it's hampered by secrets and/or deception. This would allow for loyalty to still be illustrated when "Claire's loyalty to her father is put into question when she learns of his involvement with her mother's mental illness". In addition, however, the shifting of many loyalties wouldn't have to be recorded. Matt's loyalty to Bennet, for example, is never fully established. However, his relationship with Bennet is documented in '''Groups''' and this article. My two cents (or bullets).--[[User:Baldbobbo|Bob]] 09:06, 31 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>Heroehttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304635&oldid=previmported>Baldbobbo: /* AFD */2007-05-31T13:06:18Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD</span></p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**********I think some people want to populate this page with examples, but we're all a bit busy with the new episodes. Let's give it until at least June 1 when things slow down a bit. &mdash; [[User:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>RyanGibsonStewart</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>talk</font>]]) 07:11, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**********I think some people want to populate this page with examples, but we're all a bit busy with the new episodes. Let's give it until at least June 1 when things slow down a bit. &mdash; [[User:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>RyanGibsonStewart</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>talk</font>]]) 07:11, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* What does everyone think now? -[[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Heroe|<span style="color:#FF6600">(contribs)</span>]]</small> 22:52, 29 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* What does everyone think now? -[[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Heroe|<span style="color:#FF6600">(contribs)</span>]]</small> 22:52, 29 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** We actually have content now, but I just feel like some of the content on the page isn't exactly an example of treachery or loyalty. For example, Nathan sleeping with Niki isn't an example of loyalty as much as it is an example of treachery with his wife. A better example of something for this theme would be Niki's loyalty to Nathan to tell him about Linderman's plan since she seems to like him after their night together at the hotel earlier in the season. Seeing some examples though, I think that we should extend our "deadline" a bit further. I think Ryan's idea of waiting was a good one, and we should give people some time on this. A lot of the themes are stubs, and little is being expanded. Since there's content, however, I think we should hold off. </div></td>
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<td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**That being said, my original point on the article was that secrets and deception holds more true to the majority of examples with shifts in loyalty. Niki deceitfully telling Nathan about Linderman's plan behind Jessica's back seems like a stronger example versus her loyalty to Nathan, since her "loyalty" only is shown in one example. The only strong loyalties in the show are Peter to Nathan and Bennet to Claire. The rest of the loyalties seems to taper on and off, which would be a reason for secrets and deception to be the article for this content, where an individual still maintains their loyalty eventually (Claire's loyalty to her father), but it's hampered by secrets and/or deception. This would allow for loyalty to still be illustrated when "Claire's loyalty to her father is put into question when she learns of his involvement with her mother's mental illness". In addition, however, the shifting of many loyalties wouldn't have to be recorded. Matt's loyalty to Bennet, for example, is never fully established. However, his relationship with Bennet is documented in '''Groups''' and this article. My two cents (or bullets).--[[User:Baldbobbo|Bob]] 09:06, 31 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>Baldbobbohttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304634&oldid=previmported>Heroe: /* AFD */2007-05-30T02:52:15Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD</span></p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*********So what should we do with this empty page ? Is someone really going to full it ? Because if not, then we probably should delete it. Anyway, I don't really like pages about ''feelings'', I mean, are we going to have a page for Happiness or Sadness and add each time a character smile or cry ? --&nbsp;[[User:FrenchFlo|'''FrenchFlo''']]&nbsp;[[User talk:FrenchFlo|<span style="font-size:8pt">(talk)</span>]]&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid black">[[Wikipedia:Toulouse|<span style="background-color:blue">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:white">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:red">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span>]]</span> 04:22, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*********So what should we do with this empty page ? Is someone really going to full it ? Because if not, then we probably should delete it. Anyway, I don't really like pages about ''feelings'', I mean, are we going to have a page for Happiness or Sadness and add each time a character smile or cry ? --&nbsp;[[User:FrenchFlo|'''FrenchFlo''']]&nbsp;[[User talk:FrenchFlo|<span style="font-size:8pt">(talk)</span>]]&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid black">[[Wikipedia:Toulouse|<span style="background-color:blue">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:white">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:red">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span>]]</span> 04:22, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**********I think some people want to populate this page with examples, but we're all a bit busy with the new episodes. Let's give it until at least June 1 when things slow down a bit. &mdash; [[User:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>RyanGibsonStewart</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>talk</font>]]) 07:11, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**********I think some people want to populate this page with examples, but we're all a bit busy with the new episodes. Let's give it until at least June 1 when things slow down a bit. &mdash; [[User:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>RyanGibsonStewart</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>talk</font>]]) 07:11, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* What does everyone think now? -[[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Heroe|<span style="color:#FF6600">(contribs)</span>]]</small> 22:52, 29 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>Heroehttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304633&oldid=previmported>Ryangibsonstewart: /* AFD */2007-05-04T11:11:02Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD</span></p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>********I'll work on it. There are a ''ton'' of examples of situations where characters are forced to choose to whom or to what to be loyal.--[[User:Hardvice|Hardvice]] <small>[[User talk:Hardvice|(talk)]]</small> 12:46, 23 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*********So what should we do with this empty page ? Is someone really going to full it ? Because if not, then we probably should delete it. Anyway, I don't really like pages about ''feelings'', I mean, are we going to have a page for Happiness or Sadness and add each time a character smile or cry ? --&nbsp;[[User:FrenchFlo|'''FrenchFlo''']]&nbsp;[[User talk:FrenchFlo|<span style="font-size:8pt">(talk)</span>]]&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid black">[[Wikipedia:Toulouse|<span style="background-color:blue">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:white">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:red">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span>]]</span> 04:22, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*********So what should we do with this empty page ? Is someone really going to full it ? Because if not, then we probably should delete it. Anyway, I don't really like pages about ''feelings'', I mean, are we going to have a page for Happiness or Sadness and add each time a character smile or cry ? --&nbsp;[[User:FrenchFlo|'''FrenchFlo''']]&nbsp;[[User talk:FrenchFlo|<span style="font-size:8pt">(talk)</span>]]&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid black">[[Wikipedia:Toulouse|<span style="background-color:blue">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:white">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:red">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span>]]</span> 04:22, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>Ryangibsonstewarthttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304632&oldid=previmported>FrenchFlo: /* AFD */ sp2007-05-04T08:23:04Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD: </span> sp</p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*******It's been on my [[User:Heroe#To Do|To Do list]] for a while to think of some good examples for this article, but it appear that there are any, except for the one listed. If there aren't instances of Loyalty or treachery, it can't really be a theme now, can it? [[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]]</small> 18:10, 22 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*******It's been on my [[User:Heroe#To Do|To Do list]] for a while to think of some good examples for this article, but it appear that there are any, except for the one listed. If there aren't instances of Loyalty or treachery, it can't really be a theme now, can it? [[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]]</small> 18:10, 22 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>********I'll work on it. There are a ''ton'' of examples of situations where characters are forced to choose to whom or to what to be loyal.--[[User:Hardvice|Hardvice]] <small>[[User talk:Hardvice|(talk)]]</small> 12:46, 23 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*********So what should we <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">do</ins> with this empty page ? Is someone really going to full it ? Because if not, then we probably should delete it. Anyway, I don't really like <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">pages</ins> about ''feelings'', I mean, are we going to have a page for Happiness or Sadness and add each time a character smile or cry ? --&nbsp;[[User:FrenchFlo|'''FrenchFlo''']]&nbsp;[[User talk:FrenchFlo|<span style="font-size:8pt">(talk)</span>]]&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid black">[[Wikipedia:Toulouse|<span style="background-color:blue">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:white">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:red">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span>]]</span> 04:22, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>FrenchFlohttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304631&oldid=previmported>FrenchFlo: /* AFD */2007-05-04T08:22:25Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD</span></p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*******It's been on my [[User:Heroe#To Do|To Do list]] for a while to think of some good examples for this article, but it appear that there are any, except for the one listed. If there aren't instances of Loyalty or treachery, it can't really be a theme now, can it? [[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]]</small> 18:10, 22 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*******It's been on my [[User:Heroe#To Do|To Do list]] for a while to think of some good examples for this article, but it appear that there are any, except for the one listed. If there aren't instances of Loyalty or treachery, it can't really be a theme now, can it? [[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]]</small> 18:10, 22 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>********I'll work on it. There are a ''ton'' of examples of situations where characters are forced to choose to whom or to what to be loyal.--[[User:Hardvice|Hardvice]] <small>[[User talk:Hardvice|(talk)]]</small> 12:46, 23 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*********So what should we go with this empty page ? Is someone really going to full it ? Because if not, then we probably should delete it. Anyway, I don't really like page about ''feelings'', I mean, are we going to have a page for Happiness or Sadness and add each time a character smile or cry ? --&nbsp;[[User:FrenchFlo|'''FrenchFlo''']]&nbsp;[[User talk:FrenchFlo|<span style="font-size:8pt">(talk)</span>]]&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid black">[[Wikipedia:Toulouse|<span style="background-color:blue">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:white">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:red">&nbsp;&nbsp;</span>]]</span> 04:22, 4 May 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>FrenchFlohttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304630&oldid=previmported>Hardvice at 16:46, 23 April 20072007-04-23T16:46:39Z<p></p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******I have to disagree that Loyalty isn't a theme for Mr. Bennet, the Haitian, Eden, etc. Just because we don't know where a character's loyalty ultimately lies doesn't mean we can't talk about it. For example, in ''Company Man'', Mr. Bennet's loyalty to the Company is tested multiple times: when Sandra discovers his equipment, when he's sent to kill Claude, and when he's asked to turn Claire in. Not all of those involve deception, but they all involve a question of choosing to whom to remain loyal. (For that matter, not all treachery necessarily involves deception...it's possible to betray someone to their face with no prior deceit.) I think it's the word "treachery" that's causing all the difficulty, but there is most assuredly a separate theme of conflicting loyalties.--[[User:Hardvice|Hardvice]] <small>[[User talk:Hardvice|(talk)]]</small> 16:49, 9 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*******It's been on my [[User:Heroe#To Do|To Do list]] for a while to think of some good examples for this article, but it appear that there are any, except for the one listed. If there aren't instances of Loyalty or treachery, it can't really be a theme now, can it? [[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]]</small> 18:10, 22 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*******It's been on my [[User:Heroe#To Do|To Do list]] for a while to think of some good examples for this article, but it appear that there are any, except for the one listed. If there aren't instances of Loyalty or treachery, it can't really be a theme now, can it? [[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]]</small> 18:10, 22 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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</table>imported>Hardvicehttps://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Loyalty_vs._treachery&diff=304629&oldid=previmported>Heroe: /* AFD */ my two cents2007-04-22T22:10:41Z<p><span class="autocomment">AFD: </span> my two cents</p>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******You took the words out of my mouth, Bob. I ''am'' getting hung up on the "treachery" part. "loyalty vs. allegience" would be a much better title. The treachery part is pretty much synonomous with deception, and that's probably where my egg-addled brain was going. &mdash; [[User:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>RyanGibsonStewart</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryangibsonstewart|<font color=#0147FA>talk</font>]]) 16:28, 9 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******I have to disagree that Loyalty isn't a theme for Mr. Bennet, the Haitian, Eden, etc. Just because we don't know where a character's loyalty ultimately lies doesn't mean we can't talk about it. For example, in ''Company Man'', Mr. Bennet's loyalty to the Company is tested multiple times: when Sandra discovers his equipment, when he's sent to kill Claude, and when he's asked to turn Claire in. Not all of those involve deception, but they all involve a question of choosing to whom to remain loyal. (For that matter, not all treachery necessarily involves deception...it's possible to betray someone to their face with no prior deceit.) I think it's the word "treachery" that's causing all the difficulty, but there is most assuredly a separate theme of conflicting loyalties.--[[User:Hardvice|Hardvice]] <small>[[User talk:Hardvice|(talk)]]</small> 16:49, 9 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******I have to disagree that Loyalty isn't a theme for Mr. Bennet, the Haitian, Eden, etc. Just because we don't know where a character's loyalty ultimately lies doesn't mean we can't talk about it. For example, in ''Company Man'', Mr. Bennet's loyalty to the Company is tested multiple times: when Sandra discovers his equipment, when he's sent to kill Claude, and when he's asked to turn Claire in. Not all of those involve deception, but they all involve a question of choosing to whom to remain loyal. (For that matter, not all treachery necessarily involves deception...it's possible to betray someone to their face with no prior deceit.) I think it's the word "treachery" that's causing all the difficulty, but there is most assuredly a separate theme of conflicting loyalties.--[[User:Hardvice|Hardvice]] <small>[[User talk:Hardvice|(talk)]]</small> 16:49, 9 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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<td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*******It's been on my [[User:Heroe#To Do|To Do list]] for a while to think of some good examples for this article, but it appear that there are any, except for the one listed. If there aren't instances of Loyalty or treachery, it can't really be a theme now, can it? [[User:Heroe|<span style="color:green">Heroe!</span>]]<small>[[User talk:Heroe|<span style="color:#000000">(talk)</span>]]</small> 18:10, 22 April 2007 (EDT)</div></td>
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