Theory:Joseph Sullivan - Revision history

imported>Radicell: unneeded link

2015-09-20T03:25:48Z

unneeded link

← Older revision	Revision as of 03:25, 20 September 2015
(No difference)

imported>Radicell: unneeded link

2015-09-20T03:25:48Z

unneeded link

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:25, 20 September 2015
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	:{{minus}} It could be simply because Edgar was being rude to his fellow carny, which Joseph certainly wouldn't have approved.<br />		:{{minus}} It could be simply because Edgar was being rude to his fellow carny, which Joseph certainly wouldn't have approved.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />		\| [[Joseph]] is McSorley. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />
	:{{minus}} There are other characters who are older than Ricky, all of which fit that description.<br />		:{{minus}} There are other characters who are older than Ricky, all of which fit that description.<br />
	{{plus}} He is old enough to be [[McSorley's son]]'s father.<br />		{{plus}} He is old enough to be [[McSorley's son]]'s father.<br />

imported>Altes at 10:43, 30 December 2009

2009-12-30T10:43:16Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:43, 30 December 2009
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	\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />		\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />
			:{{minus}} It could be simply because Edgar was being rude to his fellow carny, which Joseph certainly wouldn't have approved.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />		\| [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />

imported>PJDEP at 04:04, 30 December 2009

2009-12-30T04:04:06Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:04, 30 December 2009
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	:{{note}} Joseph wouldn't send Lydia away just because of her power, the carnival is a family.<br />		:{{note}} Joseph wouldn't send Lydia away just because of her power, the carnival is a family.<br />
	::{{note}} Maybe when Joseph was alive, Lydia hadn't developed [[Empathy\|her ability]] enough to find evolved humans. First of all, her ability is to sense what others feel.<br />		::{{note}} Maybe when Joseph was alive, Lydia hadn't developed [[Empathy\|her ability]] enough to find evolved humans. First of all, her ability is to sense what others feel.<br />
			{{minus}} Detecting evolved humans would not allow him to render Doyle unconscious.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />		\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />

imported>Intuitive Empath at 11:48, 23 December 2009

2009-12-23T11:48:57Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:48, 23 December 2009
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	:{{note}} It's possible they were smuggled in so that Ricky's gang could sell them at a much lower price.<br/>		:{{note}} It's possible they were smuggled in so that Ricky's gang could sell them at a much lower price.<br/>
	{{minus}} Nothing at all indicates that Joseph has ever even been to Ireland.<br />		{{minus}} Nothing at all indicates that Joseph has ever even been to Ireland.<br />
	:{{note}}
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />		\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />

imported>Altes: moved theories about Joseph's ability to Theory:Joseph's ability; and this ability was offensive; Joseph didn't have EM, pretty much explained in Bloodlines; not persuasion either (iStory)

2009-12-23T10:03:00Z

moved theories about Joseph's ability to Theory:Joseph's ability; and this ability was offensive; Joseph didn't have EM, pretty much explained in Bloodlines; not persuasion either (iStory)

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 {{theoryheader|sort=Sullivan, Joseph}}
 |-
 | Joseph had the ability to detect evolved humans. || None || {{plus}} Samuel said about Joseph, "He was my compass". The [[compass]] can detect evolved humans.<br />
@@ Line 19: / Line 7: @@
 :{{note}} Joseph wouldn't send Lydia away just because of her power, the carnival is a family.<br />
 ::{{note}} Maybe when Joseph was alive, Lydia hadn't developed [[Empathy|her ability]] enough to find evolved humans. First of all, her ability is to sense what others feel.<br />
 |-
 | Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. || None || {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />
 |-
 | [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. || None || {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />
@@ Line 40: / Line 18: @@
 {{plus}} Joseph might have used the money, he made as a mobster to start the carnival.<br />
 :{{minus}} He had [[Little Miss Goldenrod]] for that.<br />
 {{minus}} Joseph was a nice person, he wouldn't have threatened Ricky's gang.<br />
 {{minus}} Why would the carnival need iPods?<br />
 :{{note}} It's possible they were smuggled in so that Ricky's gang could sell them at a much lower price.<br/>
 {{minus}} Nothing at all indicates that Joseph has ever even been to Ireland.<br />
 |-
 | Joseph let Samuel kill him. || None || {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />

imported>Blood69: changes based on revelation of Joseph's power

2009-12-22T20:19:53Z

changes based on revelation of Joseph's power

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:19, 22 December 2009
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	:{{note}} Joseph wouldn't send Lydia away just because of her power, the carnival is a family.<br />		:{{note}} Joseph wouldn't send Lydia away just because of her power, the carnival is a family.<br />
	::{{note}} Maybe when Joseph was alive, Lydia hadn't developed [[Empathy\|her ability]] enough to find evolved humans. First of all, her ability is to sense what others feel.<br />		::{{note}} Maybe when Joseph was alive, Lydia hadn't developed [[Empathy\|her ability]] enough to find evolved humans. First of all, her ability is to sense what others feel.<br />
	\|-
	\| Joseph had some form of [[precognition]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel's somewhat headstrong personality doesn't lend itself to both leadership of a group of mutants and staying hidden from [[the Company]]. Joseph may have made predictions which allowed the carnival to stay one step ahead.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph had [[telepathy]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} During Mohinder's visit he appeared to know what Mohinder was thinking and knew more about him.<br />		\| Joseph had [[telepathy]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} During Mohinder's visit he appeared to know what Mohinder was thinking and knew more about him.<br />
	{{minus}} He would have been able to prevent Samuel from attacking him then, and possibly make him forget.<br />		{{minus}} He would have been able to prevent Samuel from attacking him then, and possibly make him forget.<br />
			{{plus}} He could have used this to knock out Eric Doyle using the persuasive aspect.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />		\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />
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	{{minus}} It is possible that he may have [[telepathy]] or [[empathic mimicry]].<br />		{{minus}} It is possible that he may have [[telepathy]] or [[empathic mimicry]].<br />
	{{minus}} He would have been able to "persuade" Samuel to forget what Mohinder said, or at least calm him down.<br />		{{minus}} He would have been able to "persuade" Samuel to forget what Mohinder said, or at least calm him down.<br />
			{{plus}} He might have used it to stop Eric Doyle.<br />
			{{plus}} Samuel accused him of manipulating his emotions, which persuasion would do.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />		\| [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />
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	::{{plus}} Calming people down can hardly be called "abusing" an ability. However, even if he manipulated Samuel to the point where it became morally questionable, one could make the argument that by restricting Samuel's free will Joseph also kept the carnival, as well as the rest of the world, safe.<br />		::{{plus}} Calming people down can hardly be called "abusing" an ability. However, even if he manipulated Samuel to the point where it became morally questionable, one could make the argument that by restricting Samuel's free will Joseph also kept the carnival, as well as the rest of the world, safe.<br />
	{{plus}} Samuel acts very apathetic and unfocused when Mohinder arrived at the carnival. This could possibly be because Joseph manipulated his emotions that way to make Samuel not want to ask questions about his past, thus making him ignorant of his true potential.<br />		{{plus}} Samuel acts very apathetic and unfocused when Mohinder arrived at the carnival. This could possibly be because Joseph manipulated his emotions that way to make Samuel not want to ask questions about his past, thus making him ignorant of his true potential.<br />
			{{plus}} This might explains how he knocked out Eric Doyle, by overwhelming his emotions.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph did not have an offensive ability. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} In the episode [[Thanksgiving]], when Joseph is about to be killed, he would have stopped Samuel to prevent his death.<br />		\| Joseph did not have an offensive ability. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} In the episode [[Thanksgiving]], when Joseph is about to be killed, he would have stopped Samuel to prevent his death.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />		\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />
			:{{minus}} And yet, he had Arnold go back in time to abort Samuel at birth.<br />
	:{{minus}} [[Danko]] was on his way. All he needed to do was keep Samuel from running until Emile arrived with a compass in one hand and an assault rifle in the other.<br />		:{{minus}} [[Danko]] was on his way. All he needed to do was keep Samuel from running until Emile arrived with a compass in one hand and an assault rifle in the other.<br />
	::{{note}} Even if Joseph arranged for Danko to come, he didn't necessarily want to have him killed, just taken away. Considering Danko was also taking evolved humans, for different purposes, Samuel would also end up near many evolved humans.<br />		::{{note}} Even if Joseph arranged for Danko to come, he didn't necessarily want to have him killed, just taken away. Considering Danko was also taking evolved humans, for different purposes, Samuel would also end up near many evolved humans.<br />

imported>Altes at 12:13, 6 December 2009

2009-12-06T12:13:51Z

imported>Intuitive Empath at 21:38, 5 December 2009

2009-12-05T21:38:35Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:38, 5 December 2009
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	\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />		\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />
	:{{minus}} [[Danko]] was on his way. All he needed to do was keep Samuel from running until Emile arrived with a compass in one hand and an assault rifle in the other.<br />		:{{minus}} [[Danko]] was on his way. All he needed to do was keep Samuel from running until Emile arrived with a compass in one hand and an assault rifle in the other.<br />
			::{{note}} Even if Joseph arranged for Danko to come, he didn't necessarily want to have him killed, just taken away. Considering Danko was also taking evolved humans, for different purposes, Samuel would also end up near many evolved humans.<br />
	:{{minus}} He knew that Samuel might someday destroy the world. He was a very practical man. Letting Samuel potentially turn into the Heroes equivalent of Galactus seems stupid and irresponsible.<br />		:{{minus}} He knew that Samuel might someday destroy the world. He was a very practical man. Letting Samuel potentially turn into the Heroes equivalent of Galactus seems stupid and irresponsible.<br />
	\|-		\|-

imported>Altes at 08:13, 5 December 2009

2009-12-05T08:13:21Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:13, 5 December 2009
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	{{minus}} He would have been able to prevent Samuel from attacking him then, and possibly make him forget.<br />		{{minus}} He would have been able to prevent Samuel from attacking him then, and possibly make him forget.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag, and ~~wonders~~ "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />		\| Joseph was romantically involved with the [[fortune teller]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Samuel slapped Edgar for calling her an old hag and wondered "what if Joseph caught [him] talking like that".<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph had the power of [[persuasion]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} He spoke with Mohinder in the imperative tone.<br />		\| Joseph had the power of [[persuasion]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} He spoke with Mohinder in the imperative tone.<br />
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	{{plus}} Samuel acts very apathetic and unfocused when Mohinder arrived at the carnival. This could possibly be because Joseph manipulated his emotions that way to make Samuel not want to ask questions about his past, thus making him ignorant of his true potential.<br />		{{plus}} Samuel acts very apathetic and unfocused when Mohinder arrived at the carnival. This could possibly be because Joseph manipulated his emotions that way to make Samuel not want to ask questions about his past, thus making him ignorant of his true potential.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph did not have an offensive ability. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} In the episode Thanksgiving, when Joseph is about to be killed, he would have stopped Samuel to prevent his death.<br />		\| Joseph did not have an offensive ability. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} In the episode [[Thanksgiving]], when Joseph is about to be killed, he would have stopped Samuel to prevent his death.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />		\| Joseph let Samuel kill him. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph knew that Samuel is an ambitious man who will try to get as powerful as possible. Joseph knew he had to be stopped, but couldn't do it himself, as he loved his brother so much. So the only way was to let him become powerful enough for others to realize it and kill him.<br />

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:13, 6 December 2009
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	{{plus}} [[Samuel]] says he needs someone to help him fill the void from his brother's death, which is why he targeted [[Peter]].<br />		{{plus}} [[Samuel]] says he needs someone to help him fill the void from his brother's death, which is why he targeted [[Peter]].<br />
	:{{minus}} Joseph took care of Samuel his whole life. After murdering him, he was left without that support and guidance.<br />		:{{minus}} Joseph took care of Samuel his whole life. After murdering him, he was left without that support and guidance.<br />
	{{plus}} [[Samuel]]'s interest in [[Edgar]]'s statement regarding meeting an empath.<br />		{{plus}} Samuel's interest in [[Edgar]]'s statement regarding meeting an empath.<br />
	:{{minus}} [[Peter]] isn't an empath anymore.<br />		:{{minus}} Peter isn't an empath anymore.<br />
	::{{plus}} Samuel might not know that. As far as he knows, Peter has a very empathic personality, and has mimicked [[Edgar]]'s power.<br />		::{{plus}} Samuel might not know that. As far as he knows, Peter has a very empathic personality, and has mimicked Edgar's power.<br />
	:{{plus}} This could explain [[Samuel]]'s interest with [[Sylar]], who has many abilities, in the same way an empath would.<br />		:{{plus}} This could explain Samuel's interest with [[Sylar]], who has many abilities, in the same way an empath would.<br />
	::{{note}} Joseph, if an empath, could have been the Swiss Army Knife of the carnival, having as many powers as he could. Losing someone so useful would need someone like another empath, or Sylar to replace.<br />		::{{note}} Joseph, if an empath, could have been the Swiss Army Knife of the carnival, having as many powers as he could. Losing someone so useful would need someone like another empath, or Sylar to replace.<br />
	{{minus}} Joseph was killed by [[Samuel]] just prior to the beginning of ''Redemption''. It seems unlikely that anyone as powerful as an empath that had absorbed all the powers of the carnival would be killed by Samuel who, while a very powerful evolved human, has never shown any extraordinary skill in combating evolved humans.<br />		{{minus}} Joseph was killed by Samuel just prior to the beginning of ''Redemption''. It seems unlikely that anyone as powerful as an empath that had absorbed all the powers of the carnival would be killed by Samuel who, while a very powerful evolved human, has never shown any extraordinary skill in combating evolved humans.<br />
	:{{plus}} Assuming the carnival does not have a regenerator, all it took was for Samuel to shoot Joseph in the throat.<br />		:{{plus}} Assuming the carnival does not have a regenerator, all it took was for Samuel to shoot Joseph in the throat.<br />
	::{{minus}} He would of at least had his guard up, Samuel killed him quite quickly and with no struggle.<br/>		::{{minus}} He would of at least had his guard up, Samuel killed him quite quickly and with no struggle.<br/>
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	{{minus}} He would have been able to "persuade" Samuel to forget what Mohinder said, or at least calm him down.<br />		{{minus}} He would have been able to "persuade" Samuel to forget what Mohinder said, or at least calm him down.<br />
	\|-		\|-
	\| [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} [[Joseph]] is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />		\| [[Joseph]] is [[McSorley]]. \|\| None \|\| {{plus}} Joseph is older than Ricky. He is capable of forming a first family that didn't work out.<br />
	:{{minus}} There are other characters who are older than Ricky, all of which fit that description.<br />		:{{minus}} There are other characters who are older than Ricky, all of which fit that description.<br />
	{{plus}} He is old enough to be [[McSorley's son]]'s father.<br />		{{plus}} He is old enough to be [[McSorley's son]]'s father.<br />
	:{{minus}} So were lots of other characters.<br />		:{{minus}} So were lots of other characters.<br />
	{{plus}} [[Joseph]] is a natural leader.<br />		{{plus}} Joseph is a natural leader.<br />
	:{{minus}} Every Company founder was a leader.<br />		:{{minus}} Every Company founder was a leader.<br />
	{{plus}} [[Joseph]] might have used the money, he made as a mobster to start the carnival.<br />		{{plus}} Joseph might have used the money, he made as a mobster to start the carnival.<br />
	:{{minus}} He had [[Little Miss Goldenrod]] for that.<br />		:{{minus}} He had [[Little Miss Goldenrod]] for that.<br />
	{{minus}} Joseph was a nice person, he wouldn't have threatened Ricky's gang~~, and besides, why would the carnival need iPods?~~<br />		{{minus}} Joseph was a nice person, he wouldn't have threatened Ricky's gang.<br />
			{{minus}} Why would the carnival need iPods?<br />
	:{{note}} It's possible they were smuggled in so that Ricky's gang could sell them at a much lower price.<br/>		:{{note}} It's possible they were smuggled in so that Ricky's gang could sell them at a much lower price.<br/>
	{{minus}} Nothing at all indicates that Joseph has ever even been to Ireland.<br />		{{minus}} Nothing at all indicates that Joseph has ever even been to Ireland.<br />