Talk:Healing touch: Difference between revisions
imported>Ricard Desi |
imported>Intuitive Empath |
||
| (246 intermediate revisions by 30 users not shown) | |||
| Line 1: | Line 1: | ||
{{power names|1|eos=[[Jeremy Greer]]'s [[ |
{{power names|1|eos="Healing touch" is listed explicitly on [[Jeremy Greer]]'s [[Assignment Tracker 2.0]] profile (''[[Tabula Rasa]]'')}} |
||
{| border="2" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="4" class="wikitable" |
{| border="2" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="4" class="wikitable" |
||
|- |
|- |
||
| Line 5: | Line 5: | ||
! Archived Topics |
! Archived Topics |
||
|- |
|- |
||
| align=center | [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1| |
| align=center | [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1|Dec 2009-Jan 2010]] || <small>{{ArchiveLinks|Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1}}</small> |
||
|- |
|||
| align=center | [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2|Jan 2010-Feb 2010]] || <small>{{ArchiveLinks|Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2}}</small> |
|||
|- |
|- |
||
|} |
|} |
||
== development ability of healing == |
|||
To me this ability is the same as healing but a step up, none of these abilities have brought people back to life once they are fully dead: I know this sounds daft how can somebody not be fully dead but you can bring people back by shocking their hearts by using electric pads; Peter was being drained and Ishi was dying but we don't know if this was to do with ability or her own health but Linderman didn't have no negative effects on him, as they both seem to have this in common.--50000JH 09:21, 24 February 2010 (EST) |
|||
== Summary == |
|||
*Not to start up an old debate, on a different board, but I don't see why '''healing touch''' is seperate from Linderman's ability. It requires basically the same method to use and accomplishes the same thing. Do we know that Linderman's ability doesn't work like Jeremy's, such as his mood affects the ability and could kill instead of heal? Didn't Linderman touch everthing he healed? It's the same thing, Jeremy just couldn't use it as well as Linderman.--[[User:Inblackestnight|Inblackestnight]] 17:04, 2 June 2010 |
|||
**The issue is that we don't know if Linderman can kill like Jeremy can. Unless we somehow get confirmation that Linderman could kill as well, they remain seperate abilities.--{{User:PJDEP/signature1}} 18:04, 2 June 2010 (EDT) |
|||
Ok, I feel we are not arriving anywhere with this discussion, so I will summarize the main points so that we can proceed in a more focused way. |
|||
***I don't argue that we don't know if Linderman can or can't do that, just that it is a very minor thing to list them as two seperate abilities when a simple note about the known difference in Jeremy's case would suffice. Not that this makes a huge difference to me but this is almost like listing Meredith and her brother's pyrokinesis seperately because his flame is blue, or making all of the Parkmans' abilities seperate, since all what they can do is not just telepathy.--[[User:Inblackestnight|Inblackestnight]] 22:22, 2 June 2010 |
|||
****SIGNATURE. *Ahem* Whether it's a big difference or not is irrelevant, we don't know if they're the same ability and there are enough inconsistencies to label them as different abilities. Both Meredith and Flint were confirmed to have pyrokinesis, and unless I'm mistaken it's the same case with Maury and Matt.--{{User:PJDEP/signature1}} 22:33, 2 June 2010 (EDT) |
|||
* We were given three possible canon names from the episodes: "total life control", "life and death" and "healing touch". All three were explicitly given (i.e, are not based on descriptions), but "healing touch" is perhaps the most explicit as it was used to outright name Jeremy's ability in an Assignment Tracker. |
|||
*****Also, the color difference in pyrokinesis and the variety of things that can be done with telepathy are logical and were properly explained. Even precognition through telepathy was explained. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 23:21, 2 June 2010 (EDT) |
|||
* The Assignment Tracker (and hence "healing touch") might be an unreliable source since the Company thought that Jeremy could only heal. |
|||
* Our naming conventions suggest that names for abilities should cover ''all'' aspects of the ability. This would discard "healing touch". However, it is possible to have exceptions to this rule (see [[telescopic vision]] for instance). |
|||
* There has been much discussion on how abilities evolve and how we split/merge abilities with different/similar aspects. We have in the wiki both examples of not merging abilities (for instance, [[precognitive dreaming]] and [[precognition]]) and examples of not splitting abilities (for instance, [[Tracy]]'s [[freezing|ability]] or the different versions of [[enhanced strength]]). So, we should treat each case separately. Let's focus on discussing Jeremy's ability only. |
|||
* "Life and death" doesn't sound like a proper ability name. This is a minor issue as having an accurate and non-speculative canon name is more important. |
|||
I think the main point is discussing whether or not to apply the "must cover all aspects" rule. If we do, Jeremy's ability is split from healing and becomes either "life and death" or "total life control". If we don't, we keep things as they are. And, please, let's discuss only Jeremy's ability; issues like Tracy or enhanced strength are actually debatable and should be kept to their appropriate talk pages or this will become a mess again. |
|||
--[[User:Referos|Referos]] 20:44, 1 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*What makes this name less accurate then something like telescopic vision is that the additional effect of Jeremy's ability isn't just not mentioned by "healing touch", it's the complete opposite of healing. After all, if Flint had developed the ability to manipulate water as well as fire, would we keep his ability as pyrokinesis just because he has an assignment tracker saying so?--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 22:24, 1 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**It seems pretty clear that the company just didn't have enough info on his ability. Ishi and Linderman can be kept as "healing touch", but Jeremy , Peter, and the Chinese woman need to be split. And while "Life and death" may not sound like a ability name, it's canon.--[[User:Ratclaws|Ratclaws]] 23:08, 1 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*** "Puppet master" does not sound remotely like an ability name, and it's used. Not to mention "Activation and deactivation," which is another ability that deals with extremes. If we can't come up with a better name for that, then I doubt we'll get a better name than "Life and death" (which is, again, canon). Whatever we decide to call it, it is clear Jeremy's ability is different. And I've said it before, but I'll say it again: We have no proof that Ishi or Linderman could kill with their ability, so saying that their ability is the same as Jeremy's is speculative. Hiro and Rachel can both teleport, but it is clear they do not have the same ability, nor do we list them as such. Just because abilities have some of the same results (teleporting, healing) does not in any way mean the abilities are the same. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 23:32, 1 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**** If were going to use "Life and Death" just because Noah said that "Jeremy can control life and death", then we should also change "Cloning" into "Multiplying" because Lauren said that "Eli was a Multiplier" --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 23:57, 2 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***** I'm not saying "Life and death" is necessarily the name we should use, but that shouldn't be an issue right now. I say for now, we remove Jeremy, Peter, and the Chinese woman, and give them their own ability page. We can discuss what to name their ability there. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 02:07, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***** Also the cloning page has been nominated for a spilt into cloning and multiplying, so that's probably not the best example to use.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 02:11, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*"Life and death" was a '''description'''. And as "appropriate" as it may sound, a description loses to an explicit name given ("healing touch"). The reason we use "puppet master", despite it not "sounding like an ability name", was because it was explicitly stated. Puppet Master stayed, Healing Touch must stay. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 00:34, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**I agree that this page should stay "Healing touch" but I in no way agree that Healing touch is Jeremy's power. And descriptions are used all the time to name abilities.--[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 00:58, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***Only when explicit names are not given. Which is not the case here. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 01:02, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**** How is "life and death" not an explicit name? Noah said "Dual ability: life and death". Yes, it's not smooth, but it's even more explicit than, say, "Bliss and horror, my father's tools" and we use that as an explicit source for Guillame's ability. I can understand that "healing touch" could take priority since it was outright named in the Assignment Tracker, but I don't agree that "life and death" is a mere description of the ability.--[[User:Referos|Referos]] 06:48, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
****I'm saying that Jeremy's ability is '''not''' "Healing touch" and therefore his ability was never given an explicit canon name. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 01:05, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**Puppet master is a different case, it describes all of the effects the ability has. However, healing touch is not appropriate considering that Jeremy was able to kill with the ability, something that is the ''exact opposite'' of killing. Assignment tracker or not, this is a special case.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 01:53, 3 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***I agree entirely with PJDEP's analogy about Flint and water control. We would not keep the name Pyrokinesis in such a case because the power becomes far, far more then that, incompassing the opposite of the original name. Jeremy's case is exactly the same- healing touch does not cover all applications of his ability, and it's not the most accurate name possible (Life and Death is, for me). This is why Jeremy and Peter should be moved, and Tracy's ability moved from Freezing to something else entirely. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 12:16, 4 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
* I still think there are strong arguments to justify a split, but I think we reached a stalemate; perhaps we could try asking a writer whether or not Jeremy's ability can be considered the same as Ishi's and Linderman's?--[[User:Referos|Referos]] 11:03, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**I don't think it's really neccesary, but that might be a good idea. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 12:41, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
"Life control" doesn't fit, because it implies Jeremy was able to revive dead - give life, but he wasn't. And besides, healing isn't giving life. Noah was incorrect here... So the name should stay as "healing touch". {{User:Altes/Signature}} 11:42, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*How does it make '''''any''''' logical sense that someone who has the ability of "Healing touch" can kill with their ability? It doesn't! Therefore, this needs to be split. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 12:41, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
** Because that's the name his ability was given. How does it make any logical sense that someone who has the ability of "telepathy" can paint the future? Or that someone with "induced radioactivity" could create an electromagnetic shockwave? Or that someone with "poison emission" could UN-emit the poison and pull it back into themselves? These abilities have very fuzzy boundaries from the get-go. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 13:00, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***Many of these have been explained and others are just plain science; with telepathy matt is able to reach a plane of consciousness that precogs use to predict the future; with induced radioactivity, isotopes are moved around the body which creates the heat ted emits, but moving these around can also cause EMPs; the poison one is the only one that hasn't been explained. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 13:04, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
****It is the exact opposite of healing. Why would we continue to call it "healing touch" when it is very clearly much more than that? And saying that it's "the name his ability was given" is not a not a viable answer because his "ability name" does '''''not''''' encompass all aspects of his ability, and is therefore majorly innaccurate and misleading. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 13:11, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*****But it does not matter what is implied by the name. His ability was explicitly classified as "healing touch", on the show itself. That's about as canon as it gets. Doyle's ability is still called "puppet master", despite the obvious grammatical error. The show calls it "healing touch" outright. Thus, his power is "healing touch". And as for "why should we called it _____ when it is clearly much more than that?", please note that nearly every power in the show has expanded and evolved to do far more amazing things than could be originally assumed. Telepathy is one particular very strong example. Telepathy in the classic sense is strictly reading someone's mind (not even "hearing thoughts", it is an ACTIVE task). And yet, our definition includes things that have nothing to do with telepathy ([[persuasion]], [[illusion]], [[mental manipulation]], [[precognition]]). Explain how it is that "telepathy" is still an acceptable ability name despite all its additional baggage, while "healing touch" is not. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 13:36, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
****** I was going to argue how telepathy encompasses all aspects we have shown, but I won't. We must focus on this ability. Anyway, it's true that "healing touch" was used to outright name the ability, but we can't simply ignore that "life and death" was also explicitly given! Noah wasn't describing the ability; he clearly name it when saying "He has a dual ability: life and death". Given that "life and death" has the same explicitness and canon level as "healing touch", but describes the power much better, why should we treat "healing touch" as superior? Just because it appeared in a (possibly outdated) Assignment Tracker? There's nothing in our naming conventions that state that Assignment Tracker names take priority; we just generally use them because, frequently, they are the only explicit source available. However, the naming conventions are clear that an ability name must encompass all aspects of an ability.--[[User:Referos|Referos]] 14:28, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*******Using the assignment trackers for ability names is just a precedent we have set, that doesn't mean it will always be the best choice. If Jeremy can kill as well as heal, the name "healing touch" is not appropriate.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 15:30, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
********Life control can be a viable name. Jeremy heals and kills by, for the sake of argument, increasing and decreasing life in a person. He can kill because he decreases life until there is no more life, but he can't resurrect people because he can't "increase" life once there is no more life for him to increase. And in answer to the telepathy issue, everything Matt does can result from pulling and pushing thoughts, which is what telepathy does. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 19:15, 6 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
******** On the latest episode Peter said that Rene "The Haitian" have: power negation and memory deleting. Two ability named as one, shouldn't we do the same with Jeremy? Let's take him out of the Healing Touch page and then decide what to name on his ability --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 06:47, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
********* I would like to point out that Noah said that the "previous case" of this was that the woman manifested as a healer, "but it had a flip side". Not "but it was a different power completely". It implies that this power is in fact correct, but had a darker angle as well. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 11:51, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
********** Noah said she was the same as Jeremy, if she manifested as healer and then grew to killing as well, it's the same as Jeremy. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 12:00, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*********** I agree, that was what Noah said --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 23:55, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
== Cannot be "Life and Death" == |
|||
In rewatching [[Strange Attractors]], Noah says: |
|||
:''He has... what you'd call a dual ability: life and death.'' |
|||
The important part here is that he says it is "what you'd call" a dual ability. This implies a description, and not an official name. If he had said "He has a dual ability: life and death." it might be a different case. However, the use of "what you'd call" defeats "life and death" as an explicit name, and thus cannot be higher canon than "healing touch". --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 12:42, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
* Agree and agree! {{User:Altes/Signature}} 12:49, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
** We've used descriptive names before, and while descriptive, it gives a more comprehensible explanation to what he does, which includes the killing part. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 13:11, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***Now I agree that it should not be called life and death, but I still don't like the fact it's called healing touch. Here's a good way to explain why Healing touch from the assignment tracker cannot be used. Peter has [[ability replication]], yes? Yet [[Edgar]] called him an empath. [[Claude]] called him an empath in S1 as he had [[Empathic mimicry]]. So, does our descriptive name for his present ability, top what Edgar said he has. Yes. The reason for this is; Edgar got it wrong. Just like the company did with Jeremy. It started out as healing touch, yes I agree, but then it changed. Do you not agree that Jeremy's ability is not the same as Ishi's and Linderman's, because right now, before we decide what to call it, we should consider whether it is actually the same ability. |
|||
**** I agree --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 00:00, 8 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***** I always wondered, how does "I met an empath" imply Peter can absorb powers? Sylar, Arthur and Linda can absorb powers, none of them is an empath. Maybe Edgar meant something else? {{User:Altes/Signature}} 03:57, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
Jeremy's had different limits, but could do the same thing as Linderman and Ishi. Same goes for Peter and Arthur. They could both have multiple powers, but Arthur could not take them at a distance, like Peter. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 13:12, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*Rachel and Hiro can both teleport, but they have different abilities. Hiro can manipulate time as well. Same applies in this case. [[User:Intuitive Empath|Intuitive Empath]] - [[User talk:Intuitive Empath|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Intuitive Empath|Contributions]] 13:27, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**Healing Touch should be invalidated as a name for consideration anyway, regardless of the status of Life and Death. From the naming conventions: ''" For a possible name to be considered the name of an ability, it should include at least all aspects of the ability which have been displayed; otherwise, it is considered to be the name of an aspect or effect of the ability".'' Does "healing touch" encompass all aspects of the ability which have been displayed? No, as it completly ignores his ability to kill with it. Hence, the name should be ruled out. [[User:Swmystery|Swm]] 13:31, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*Looking at the quote, I feel as if "dual ability" was the description, not "life and death". He may have simply just coined a phrase for any ability with two major functions and made reference to it.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 15:44, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
** No, I don't see how this shows that "life and death" is not explicit. The way I understand it, a name is explicit given if we use it exactly as it is given, and implicit if we derived it. For example, "invisibility" from "Look Claude, I'm invisible!" is an implicit name, but the assignment tracker calling it "ability: invisibility" is explicit. Noah clearly gave the term "life and death"; we aren't creating the name from a phrase like "Jeremy can give life and can give death" or something like that, so "life and death" is an explicit name, not an implicit description. Besides, as PJDEP pointed out, "what you'd call" could easily refer to the term "dual ability".--[[User:Referos|Referos]] 17:53, 7 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*** When Gretchen asked if she could see Claire's power, she asked, "See what, the healing?" But it stays as "rapid cell regeneration", taken from Chandra's files. {{User:Altes/Signature}} 03:57, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**** That's not the same in that both "healing" and "rapid cell regeneration" cover all aspects of her ability. Or, they don't directly oppose the aspects of her ability. Killing with a '''healing''' touch makes little sense.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 14:01, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
Guys lets decide to split Jeremy out of the Healing Touch page first and named it Jeremy's Ability while we debated on an ability name --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 00:00, 8 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*Thank you. I feel the same way. --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 00:10, 8 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*I also agree. To add to the Hiro point made above. His ability name covers the dual ability. Healing touch, however, doesn't. The source trying to be used to claim his ability as Healing Touch is OUTDATED source. I feel like we're debating if the world is flat or not. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 20:48, 8 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*Well, freezing doesn't cover the water control aspect, telepathy doesn't cover painting the future etc. It is just an example of ability development. {{User:Altes/Signature}} 03:57, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**We both know that freezing is an unstable example to use at the moment with the current debate. Telepathy, even though it's very stretched, does describe how Matt is able to paint the future. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 09:26, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*** Not really. Telepathy is the ability to control humans' minds. Matt accesses a plane of consciousness precogs use to paint the future. The connection isn't as clear as you might believe. {{User:Altes/Signature}} 09:30, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
****Never said the connection was clear. Personally I think it's the worst writing I have ever seen on the show. However, as we understand it, telepathy is anything to do with the mind and the consciousness. It's the biggest stretch, but it can still be explained within the word telepathy (even though I don't like it). Healing touch is a cut and dry term. Simple explain to me how the power to heal with touch can kill someone and I'll switch sides. Until then I believe that The Company jumped conclusions before they fully understood Jeremy's ability. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 10:03, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
****Also, precognition is not the opposite of telepathy, but killing is the opposite of healing touch.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 14:01, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
The word kinesis, also used as a suffix implies all types of movement or motions whether minimal or many, i.e. Pyrokinesis, an ability which can be controlled by a simple hand gesture, opening and closing of a hand, performed by Meredith who also made an inside of a shipping container extremely hot by touching it. This of course didn't require much hand motions, only a plain palm to surface touch. There are more similar example, yet just that alone is demonstrating kinesis. Now, Vita- a prefix pertaining to vitality or life is suitable in describing upon this abilty the workings of it. To heal or hurt vital organs explains the functions in accordance to the name. There are not alot of accurate titles ascribed to Jeremy's ability. Overall, I think calling it Vitakinesis justifies the means. — Mphyire 21:15, 8 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*Please, can we NOT discuss possible names for Jeremy's ability? We kinda just said that. We need to decide to give Jeremy's ability its own page (becasue it is clearly not the same as Linderman's or Ishi's) before we can decide on a name. There are two issues here, so lets get the first one out of the way before moving on to the second one, ok? --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 00:21, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*Also, we only create ability names if there are no canon, near-canon, or common names for the ability. It's essentially a last result. Given that we appear to have a wide variety of names to choose from that originate in higher ranking sources we cannot create our own name, as accurate as it may be.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 00:24, 9 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
** Even though there was a canon name "Healing Touch" it does not cover all of Jeremy's ability, and on what we saw on the series clearly it was not the same as Linderman and Ishi. On the naming convention page it says that "When a possible name for an ability appears in a canon, near-canon, or secondary source, it is important to consider whether the name describes the ability itself or merely one or more of its effects or applications: As a general rule, for a possible name to be considered the name of an ability, it should include at least all aspects of the ability which have been displayed; otherwise, it is considered to be the name of an aspect or effect of the ability." --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 00:01, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
Guys please, lets solve a problem one at a time, this discussion will not be over because we are taking two problems at a time. --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 00:01, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*We already had a consensus, 14 wanted the split, and 4 opposed.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 01:06, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**Technically, only 3 opposed. Just saying :P --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 01:47, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**Consensus isn't simply a majority vote, it's more complicated than that. The issues raised by both sides are too substantial to either move this to "Jeremy's ability" or to end the discussion completely. The continuing discussion will help sort things out. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 01:10, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*** The issue is however, that we haven't gotten anywhere beyond "Healing touch is canon, it must stay, other ability names are misleading and we don't change them" and "Killing is the opposite of healing, it can't stay, the other abilities not as misleading." It seems like there is little more to discuss.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 01:14, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**** There are more arguements FOR the split, one major one being that since we never saw/heard of Ishi or Linderman killing by touch through their ability, it is extremely speculative to say that they have the same ability as Jeremy. Rachel has ONLY Teleportation, unlike Hiro who has Teleportation plus Time Manipulation plus Time Travel; are they considered to have the same ability? Not at all. I do not see why we consider Jeremy to have the same ability as Linderman and Ishi. If we go by that, we might as well change Rachel's ability to "Space/Time manipulation." Oh wait, that would be extremely speculative. And yet, Jeremy still has the ability of "Healing touch"? His touch also KILLS; you know, the exact opposite of healing. We had this same problem with Matt Jr.'s ability, because it dealt with two ends of the spectrum. It was decided that 'Activation" alone did not fully cover all aspects of his ability (it only covered HALF of his ability) and therefore it was disregarded as an possible ability name. And yet Jeremy still is considered to have "Healing touch"? His current ability name does not cover all aspects of his ability, only HALF of them. Therefore, it should be disregarded, REGARDLESS of what it was called on an Asignment Tracker (that was outdated). Our naming conventions state that even if an ability is named canonicly, it must be considered if said name fully covers all aspects of the ability; if it does not, the name should be changed. It is so obvious that Jeremy's ability is different it is painful, and I see no real arguements from the opposing viewpoints other than "its a canon name." And actually, saying that Linderman, Ishi, and Jeremy all have the ability of "Healing touch" is like saying both Rachel and Hiro have the ability of "Teleportation". Does it make any sense whatsoever? No. So why, after all these reasons that are as apparent as a punch in the head, hasn't this article been split yet? It's dragged on for way longer than it's needed too. It's like pulling teeth, except we aren't getting anywhere! (God alone knows why, cause I can't figure it out) --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 01:47, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
***** Actually, it was never said Linderman and Ishi had "healing touch". {{User:Altes/Signature}} 02:03, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
****** That further supports a split.--[[User:PJDEP|PJDEP]] 02:06, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
I would like to point out that we included Rachel and Hiro on the same page until a writer confirmed that they were separate powers. Jeremy's ability is to heal things by touch, as well as to remove health by touch. His ability is listed, by what has been considered the HIGHEST canon source in the series (The Company), as "healing touch". Everyone keeps citing the naming conventions, and how they say that names should include all aspects of the ability. However, it would appear that everyone misses ''the very first rule on that page'', which states: '''''If a name is given for a ability in a canon source, that name should be used, regardless of whether it is the best description or not.''''' We have been given an explicit, canon name for this ability. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 02:55, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*The order of the rules doesn't define which one is more important or should be followed most. It just goes to show that the rules contradict each other. That's like saying A comes before B always then having a rule that says B can come before A sometimes. The rules are flawed right now and they need to addressed and fixed in order for us to settle this and many other debates. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 05:45, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
**For us to fix the rules, it would have to be in an order such as: |
|||
***# The name must cover all aspects of the ability |
|||
***# The name should be taken in the order Canon, Near canon, secondary, '''as long as this does not conflict with the first rule'''. |
|||
**It would be like the 3 laws of robotics, the next one is allowed as long as it doesn't contradict any of the previous ones. --[[User:Mc hammark|mc_hammark]] 13:11, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
****haha saw I Robot last night too? I personally think setting the rules up like this would be great. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 13:42, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*****Are we suggesting Naming Convention Conventions? :P I think having an ordered-by-priority set of rules would be a good idea. However the rules line up from there, I'll follow suit. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 14:54, 10 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
******There are rules for the naming, but there were also a guideline for it. I read it somewhere here and I like to say it again as an example: What if someone with the ability to control fire named as cryokinesis on the series that are considered as a canon, are we going to use it? Yes the first on the line of the rule was if a name from a canon was given it must be used. But it said on the guidelines that even though a name comes from a canon source the name should consider all the aspect of the ability that we have seen. Healing was appropriate for Linderman (trough touch) and Ishi (trough kiss) because we saw them heal and we didn't see them kill. On Jeremy on the other hand, Healing as they show it was only an aspect of what he can do. The description of: Rule was "An authoritative, prescribed direction for conduct, especially one of the regulations governing procedure in a legislative body or a regulation observed by the players in a game, sport, or contest". While Guidelines was "A statement or other indication of policy or procedure by which to determine a course of action" --[[User:Darkfiremaster13|Darkfiremaster13]] 00:01, 12 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
== Ok now... == |
|||
I feel this issue has not been resolved by any means. The consensus we had was 14 people for the split and only 3 against. 8 to 1 was enough to change [[Toby's ability]]. Can we just change this one already? --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 15:16, 22 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*or at least get an admin's view on the matter at hand? --[[User:Skullman1392|Skullman1392]] 15:17, 22 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
*The 8-to-1 was to see which of "Inflammation" and "Excruciation" was the better name, when there was little if any opposition to giving it one of the two names. This is an instance of an explicitly-named ability having its name changed, with the arguments on both sides being too large to come to a conclusion just yet. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 15:48, 22 December 2009 (EST) |
|||
Latest revision as of 03:21, 3 June 2010
| Ability Naming Conventions | |
|---|---|
| The following sources are used for determining evolved human ability names, in order: | |
| Episodes | |
| 2. Near-canon Sources | Webisodes, Graphic Novels, iStories, Heroes Evolutions |
| 3. Secondary Sources | Episode commentary, Interviews, Heroes: Survival |
| 4. Common names for abilities | Names from other works |
| 5. Descriptions of abilities | Descriptions |
| 6. Possessor's name | If no non-speculative description is possible |
| Source/Explanation | |
| "Healing touch" is listed explicitly on Jeremy Greer's Assignment Tracker 2.0 profile (Tabula Rasa). | |
| Archives | Archived Topics |
|---|---|
| Dec 2009-Jan 2010 | [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] |
| Jan 2010-Feb 2010 | [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error message]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] • [[Talk:Healing touch/Archive 2# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The error messag]] |
development ability of healing
To me this ability is the same as healing but a step up, none of these abilities have brought people back to life once they are fully dead: I know this sounds daft how can somebody not be fully dead but you can bring people back by shocking their hearts by using electric pads; Peter was being drained and Ishi was dying but we don't know if this was to do with ability or her own health but Linderman didn't have no negative effects on him, as they both seem to have this in common.--50000JH 09:21, 24 February 2010 (EST)
- Not to start up an old debate, on a different board, but I don't see why healing touch is seperate from Linderman's ability. It requires basically the same method to use and accomplishes the same thing. Do we know that Linderman's ability doesn't work like Jeremy's, such as his mood affects the ability and could kill instead of heal? Didn't Linderman touch everthing he healed? It's the same thing, Jeremy just couldn't use it as well as Linderman.--Inblackestnight 17:04, 2 June 2010
- The issue is that we don't know if Linderman can kill like Jeremy can. Unless we somehow get confirmation that Linderman could kill as well, they remain seperate abilities.--PJDEP - Talk - Polls and Opinions 18:04, 2 June 2010 (EDT)
- I don't argue that we don't know if Linderman can or can't do that, just that it is a very minor thing to list them as two seperate abilities when a simple note about the known difference in Jeremy's case would suffice. Not that this makes a huge difference to me but this is almost like listing Meredith and her brother's pyrokinesis seperately because his flame is blue, or making all of the Parkmans' abilities seperate, since all what they can do is not just telepathy.--Inblackestnight 22:22, 2 June 2010
- SIGNATURE. *Ahem* Whether it's a big difference or not is irrelevant, we don't know if they're the same ability and there are enough inconsistencies to label them as different abilities. Both Meredith and Flint were confirmed to have pyrokinesis, and unless I'm mistaken it's the same case with Maury and Matt.--PJDEP - Talk - Polls and Opinions 22:33, 2 June 2010 (EDT)
- Also, the color difference in pyrokinesis and the variety of things that can be done with telepathy are logical and were properly explained. Even precognition through telepathy was explained. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 23:21, 2 June 2010 (EDT)
- SIGNATURE. *Ahem* Whether it's a big difference or not is irrelevant, we don't know if they're the same ability and there are enough inconsistencies to label them as different abilities. Both Meredith and Flint were confirmed to have pyrokinesis, and unless I'm mistaken it's the same case with Maury and Matt.--PJDEP - Talk - Polls and Opinions 22:33, 2 June 2010 (EDT)
- I don't argue that we don't know if Linderman can or can't do that, just that it is a very minor thing to list them as two seperate abilities when a simple note about the known difference in Jeremy's case would suffice. Not that this makes a huge difference to me but this is almost like listing Meredith and her brother's pyrokinesis seperately because his flame is blue, or making all of the Parkmans' abilities seperate, since all what they can do is not just telepathy.--Inblackestnight 22:22, 2 June 2010
- The issue is that we don't know if Linderman can kill like Jeremy can. Unless we somehow get confirmation that Linderman could kill as well, they remain seperate abilities.--PJDEP - Talk - Polls and Opinions 18:04, 2 June 2010 (EDT)