Talk:Neurocognitive deficit: Difference between revisions
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{{power names|1|eos=The term "neurocognitive deficit" is referred to in the [[Mozaic file]] (''[[The Fix]]'') and appears to match Anna's ability}} |
{{power names|1|eos=The term "neurocognitive deficit" is referred to in the [[Mozaic file]] (''[[The Fix]]'') and appears to match Anna's ability}} |
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== I'm sorry, but no. == |
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! Archives |
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"Lobotomize" was CLEARLY a description she gave, since she still doesn't quite understand what her power is. This page is pretty ridiculous (the most glaring bit being that a "lobotomy" is a specific type of surgery) --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 21:48, 24 December 2008 (EST) |
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! Archived Topics |
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**Kill it. [[User:Psilaq Remake|Psilaq Remake]] 23:14, 24 December 2008 (EST) |
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| align=center | [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1|Dec 2008-Apr 2009]] || <small>{{ArchiveLinks|Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1}}</small> |
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*** If it's the split that's the issue, that's one thing. I understand somebody started a discussion in a place that may not be the most intuitive ([[Talk:Anna]]). However, it wasn't the "wrong" place to start a discussion, and doesn't negate the fact that we just don't know that Anna and the Haitian have the same power. There are a lot of things that fit, and a few that don't fit exactly. But until it's confirmed, we shouldn't assume. <p> If it's the name of the ability that's an issue, that's another deal. Let's look at some other possibilities. Are there other options? Is there anything else from the [[iStory]] or ''[[Red Eye, Part 1]]'' we can use to name the ability? Mohinder describes the ability as being able to disorient sensory perception, motor commands, language skills, and even conscious thought. (I'm borrowing from Miami's excellent summary at [[talk:mental manipulation]].) "Sensory perception disorientation" seems both unwieldy and too narrow. Would something simpler like "disorientation" work? I think we have enough information that we don't need to simply say "Anna's ability". -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 01:23, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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**** At the absolute least the name is entirely wrong as she does not, in actuality, lobotomize anyone. She shuts down upper brain functions. On top of this, the description Mohinder gives sounds a lot like it can apply to mental manipulation just as easily. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 01:46, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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**** I think merging the abilities without pointing anyone there was 'wrong'. I don't see why the term 'mental manipulation' doesn't fit her. Based on Mohinder's description, manipulation minds appears to me to be what she does and I haven't seen anyone suggest otherwise, just that we don't know for sure she has the Haitian's ability. I really think that should be irrelevant in naming her ability, but would we be able to compromise have the Haitian's ability be "mental manipulation (I)" and have hers be "mental manipulation (II)"? Isn't it clear that they are both forms of mental manipulation?<p />Disorientation doesn't cut it as that doesn't really encompass all she can do. Mohinder's full [http://www.nbc.com/Heroes/iStory/chapters/202/UEgxMjE1MC1k quote]:<br />{{blurb}}"[Anna] has a truly incredible ability to shut down the upper brain functions of those around her."<br />"Her abilities have been known to affect and disorient sensory perception, motor commands, language skills, and even conscious thought."{{blurbclose}}<br />So she just doesn't disorient, she can presumably affect them in other ways.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 01:52, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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== This is embarrassing... == |
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*****That's what Lobotomizing does so of course it would affect affect and disorient sensory perception, motor commands, language skills, and even conscious thought. Her ability is to '''shut down''' the upper brain functions. Mental manipulation can do much more than just shut down that part of the brain. Anna hasn't done anything else besides lobotomizing someone. Until she does something else it would be pure speculation that she has Mental manipulation that allows for much more to be done. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 02:00, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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...but we completely forgot to rename this page! This power should never have been called neurocognitive deficit in the first place for the same reasons given in [[talk:mental manipulation]]. "Lobotomization" might be a bit awkward but fits and is near-canon; is it an adequate choice?--[[User:Referos|Referos]] 19:11, 1 December 2009 (EST) |
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***** You're right, Miami, the term "mental manipulation" does fit Anna's ability. But we're not matching terms, we're matching abilities. We just don't know that Anna and the Haitian have the same ability. "Mental manipulation" also fits for describing what Candice does and what Doyle does. I have absolutely no problem calling Anna's ability "mental manipulation"...but there is a big problem in listing her and the Haitian on the same page as having the same ability. It's speculative. I suppose doing a parenthetical note would work...but so long as we're using the term for one person, I really don't like the idea of using it for somebody else to describe what might be a different power. Isn't there another term we could use? -- {{User:Ryangibsonstewart/sig}} 02:00, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*Throwing my hat into the ring with these 2 cents; in [[It Takes a Village, Part 2]], [[the Haitian]] does pretty much the same thing to his village when [[Guillame]] is beating him. He also is negating his father's ability, something Anna has '''not''' been shown to be able to do with her ability (I think Ricardo was able to use his ability whilst she was using hers, not sure on that). Take it for what you will. --{{User:SacValleyDweller/sig}} 02:09, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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** Wasn't the original reason the fact that it's speculative to say that "neurocognitive deficit" in the Mozaic file was referring to Anna's / René's ability? Similar to matching "Dynamic camouflage" from the Genesis files with invisibility? Even if the Anna and René have different abilities, shouldn't this same reason still hold?--[[User:Referos|Referos]] 19:47, 1 December 2009 (EST) |
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**Anna didn't want to use her ability on Red Eye, as she feels sorry that he lost his family and doesn't want to harm him.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 02:13, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*** Actually, it was clarified that we don't know what the terms in the Mozaic file were referring to--so to discuss whether or not it is speculation that the term was referring to an ability is meaningless. It does help that it is a term used in the show, but what matters most is that neurocognitive deficit is a good descriptive term for the ability that we agreed not to oppose. Those terms for René's and Claude's abilities are a different case as they don't seem to cover all aspects of the ability they are supposed to describe. In René's discussion, we noted that he has two unique aspects to his ability so "neurocognitive deficit" would not necessarily apply. "Dynamic camouflage" doesn't apply to Claude's ability as light seemed to pass through him when he was invisible (camouflage still creates shadows), and also invisibility seems to be the more common/accurate term).--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 21:14, 1 December 2009 (EST) |
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**I strongly believe the name should stay. What Anna said about her ability is now cannon and should be taken into account with naming her ability. No different than what we did for [[Ability supercharging]]. Also the term isn't at all wrong. All you have to do is do a search and right away you discover if fits. Here's an [http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/lobotomization example]. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 02:17, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*** Anna didn't outright name her own ability, she described it and so has Mohinder. Based on the descriptions, I favor Anna's ability as "mental manipulation". I like the term "neurocognitive deficit" as a narrower term for Anna's ability too. It was suggested previously for the Haitian's ability, but rejected due to speculation about how the ability blocking was performed. There is as-yet no such speculation in using the term to describe Anna's ability.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 02:38, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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**** Merge it back to Mental manipulation, this is not even close. Although knowing how things around here work, I won't be suprised if this stays it's own page for a few weeks.--[[User:Piemanmoo|Piemanmoo]] ([[User talk:Piemanmoo|talk]]) 02:45, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*****The term that she used to describe does indeed make for a proper name for her ability. Lobotomization is a real term that describes exactly what her ability does. [[Ability supercharging]]] is the the ability to supercharge other evolved human abilities, [[Appearance alteration]] is the ability ability to change one's appearance, [[Dream manipulation]] is the ability to manipulate dreams, [[Healing]] is the ability to heal others, [[Lie detection]] is the ability to detect lies. So it would make logical sense to to call Anna's ability Lobotomization because it's the ability to lobotomize others, and when you lobotomize someone you shut down the upper brain functions. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 02:51, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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****** Lobotomization is done by cutting the nerve's in a person's brain. We don't know if that's what she does. In fact, in chapter 3 of [[Operation Bad Blood]], she had begun using her ability on the Pinehearst contractor but got stopped due to the eclipse and the player had no lasting brain damage. That suggests to me that it's likely not a simple cutting that her ability performs but instead some kind of biochemical reaction. However, we don't really know which it is meaning it's not really the best name.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 02:59, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*******But the term has also been use in other media (i.e. comics) resources to describe the same thing. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 03:01, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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******** Scientific references are normally preferred over comics ones when available; also a common misnomer is still a misnomer.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 03:07, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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********What she said is a near cannon source and it ranks over coming up with a different term. Lobotomization is also scientific in itself. However, let's first worry about if we're going to keep this article or not. Then and only then should we worry about the name of the article. Because why worry about the name if the article may get deleted. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 03:10, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*********An administrator, Ryan, already said he preferred not to recombine the articles, so I doubt that's going to happen though I would like it to. He asked us to consider a different name. "Lobotomization" wasn't explicitly used, it's a name you're taking from a description that doesn't seem to apply based on what has occurred. If we cannot agree on a name, this will become "Anna's ability" as descriptive names must be completely agreed upon in order to be used by Admin's instructions.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 03:20, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*In the example for a definition I provided it is stated to make (someone or something) abnormally tranquil or sluggish. Is that not what she has done?--[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 03:26, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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**No, she is also capable of making a person unconscious, not just sluggish and while under the effects of her ability, Red Eye was able to make the Kill Squad express rage (not tranquility) and they didn't seem sluggish. She also claims to have had enhanced senses when she first used her ability (chapter 4, Operation Bad Blood). That is more in line with what the Haitian said about being able to read minds while erasing them, but not necessarily the exact same thing.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 03:41, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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***Did not know some of that (said somewhere, note sure if here, that I'm not too familiar with the iStores). Alright then I agree with the name you came up with earlier. Good debate my friend. --[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 03:46, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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**** Thanks. I've updated it to neurocognitive deficit for now. I still think the Haitian's and Anna's abilities are the same, but this is a good second choice and the name comes from an episode.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 04:05, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*****Yeah I saw that you said it was from [[The Fix]], but I'm not recalling it. What point was the name shown?--[[User:OutbackZack|OutbackZack]] 04:07, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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****** It's on the Mozaic File that Mohinder shows to Nathan.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 04:19, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*****Woah! since when was 2 people enough to rename something? We got some "'''Name A''' kinda sorta can describe '''Power B''', so we'll call this by '''Name A'''" logical leaps going on here that just don't seem right. I'm calling for consensus on this. --{{User:SacValleyDweller/sig}} 13:58, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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****** You don't really need a consensus check since this is a descriptive name and one person disagreeing with the name is all it takes to go to Anna's ability if that's what you want. Lobotomization isn't necessarily accurate and doesn't encompass the ability based on what we know, and Ryan, an administrator has said he prefers not to use "mental manipulation". I suggested we use 'neurocognitive deficit' since it has been discussed before for the Haitian's ability and the person who was supporting lobotomization supported the move so that was all the consensus that was necessary. No other names had been suggested.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 17:40, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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**** User:Shadowulf1 13:46, 25 December 2008 (EST) Wasn't her power already defined as [[mental manipulation]]? even if she only has one aspect of it, which she doesn't, it would still be classified as such... right? |
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***** See above comments by Ryan--being Anna's base ability isn't enough. It would be like saying Rachel Mills has time-space manipulation instead of teleportation without seeing her travel through time first.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 17:40, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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== Consensus check and argument restaments == |
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ok, just so we can clear things up from the above mess...--{{User:SacValleyDweller/sig}} 14:04, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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*Can we also clarify: Is this consensus to "change to neurocognitive deficit", since it was split from mental manipulation without consensus, or is this consensus to "merge to mental manipulation"? They seem to be in a dead heat, and which one we're debating makes a big difference. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 21:36, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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** Saying there is a dead heat is misleading. There is no dead heat as consensus does not work by voting. Also, mental manipulation isn't really an option as it is being considered speculative by Ryan and others (who posted on [[Talk:Anna]]) that Anna and the Haitian have the same ability due to her not blocking abilities. I disagree that that should exclude Anna and prefer mental manipulation, but without his agreement there cannot be consensus to move this ability back there. Thus, the options are really neurocognitive deficit, Anna's ability or something else. No one has yet suggesting going back to Anna's ability and no one has suggested anything else.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 22:30, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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** I'm not planning on getting involved in this until I have a chance to catch up on the iStory (and it will probably be over by then), but I think this should be a special case. Since information was moved without reaching a consensus first, it seems to me this should be vote-based rather than needing a consensus to revert. This is, of course, up to the administrators, but since protocol was not followed initially, it seems unfair to follow it now, imho. --[[User:Stevehim|Stevehim]] 21:54, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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*** Voting isn't ever used in determining ability names (if you want to ask for that to change, the best place to ask for a consensus to do so is on [[Help talk:Naming conventions]]). There have been prior name moves without consensus that the administrators have supported that either stayed or were changed to something else like the current situation. In this case, there was a consensus on [[Talk:Anna]], including Ryan's opinion, to remove Anna's ability from mental manipulation but that was essentially forum shopping as no notice was made on any ability page that a move was being considered before the move occurred. After the move occurred to lobotomization, I asked for it to be moved back on the mental manipulation talk page and was directed instead to discuss it here. Ryan pointed out here that he didn't feel it was right for Anna's and the Haitian's ability to be named the same and asked for another name. Then, the person who had supported lobotomization and moved the page to that name agreed with me on moving it "neurocognitive deficit" creating a new consensus so it was moved to the current name.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 22:30, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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===Merge back with [[Mental manipulation]]=== |
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#was there any consensus to split it apart from MM in the first place? Why do we need one to correct it?--[[User:Piemanmoo|Piemanmoo]] 20:17, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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#There was no consensus to split it in the first place, and the description given by Mohinder fits the profile of Mental Manipulation. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 20:24, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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#If there wasn't a consensus before splitting the article, I say we merge it back before deciding on any further course of action. --[[User:Ciwey|Ciwey]] 21:42, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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#[[User:Psilaq Remake|Psilaq Remake]] 21:50, 25 December 2008 (EST) No reason not to re-merge. |
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#Same reasons as the people above. --[[User:Michael|Mike N.]] 18:39, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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#[[User:Yamawhata?|Yamawhata?]] 21:42, 26 December 2008 (EST) If nothing else, move MM to this one instead. I still think Neurocognitive Deficit provides not only a description, but a mechanism for the Haitian's power. I haven't yet seen any good reason to separate the two other than 'Anna has not wiped someone's memory.' That should be a good enough reason to split Knox's ability from enhanced strength - Knox hasn't used his ability without someone being afraid. Besides, we have plenty of examples of people with [[Telepathy|the same ability]] doing things that others can't, but we never disputed those, did we? If we're going to use a level 5 name (description) we made up, I don't think we can differentiate between two abilities which both fit our description - this manipulates the mind, so it is '''mental manipulation''' plain and simple. --[[User:Yamawhata?|Yamawhata?]] 02:42, 27 December 2008 |
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===Keep as Neurocognitive deficit=== |
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#--{{User:NiveKJ13/sig1}} 14:15, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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#--[[User:UrNoob|Max]] 15:58, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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#--[[User:Laughingdevilboy|laughingdevilboy]] 17:47, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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#--[[User:Dracomaster4|Dracomaster4]] 20:38, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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#--[[User:Litox|Litox]] 14:20, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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#--[[User:Henryp|Henryp]] |
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#--[[User:Witchy2006|Witchy2006]] 15:52, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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#--[[User:Ikkian|Ikkian]] 17:19, 26 December 2008 (EST) |
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===Keep as Lobotomization=== |
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<s>#-- [[User:Laughingdevilboy|laughingdevilboy]] 16:16, 25 December 2008 (EST)</s> |
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* Lobotomization isn't an option since it does not accurately encompass her ability based on what we know. Would you rather her ability be called just "Anna's ability"? That is the only other option at this time unless you suggest another.--[[User:MiamiVolts|MiamiVolts]] ([[User_talk:MiamiVolts|talk]]) 17:43, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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**sorry I didn't realise, if that's the case I will add my name to Neurocognitive deficit --[[User:Laughingdevilboy|laughingdevilboy]] 17:47, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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***The term itself is wrong, regardless of accuracy. A lobotomy is a specific type of surgery. This is not. --[[User:Ricard Desi|Ricard Desi]] ([[User talk:Ricard Desi|t]],[[Special:Contributions/Ricard Desi|c]]) 20:24, 25 December 2008 (EST) |
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Latest revision as of 07:13, 24 February 2010
| Ability Naming Conventions | |
|---|---|
| The following sources are used for determining evolved human ability names, in order: | |
| Episodes | |
| 2. Near-canon Sources | Webisodes, Graphic Novels, iStories, Heroes Evolutions |
| 3. Secondary Sources | Episode commentary, Interviews, Heroes: Survival |
| 4. Common names for abilities | Names from other works |
| 5. Descriptions of abilities | Descriptions |
| 6. Possessor's name | If no non-speculative description is possible |
| Source/Explanation | |
| The term "neurocognitive deficit" is referred to in the Mozaic file (The Fix) and appears to match Anna's ability. | |
| Archives | Archived Topics |
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| Dec 2008-Apr 2009 | [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. 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Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The erro]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] • [[Talk:Neurocognitive deficit/Archive 1# Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err| Extension:DynamicPageList3 (DPL3), version 3.6.1: Error: MediaWiki\Extension\DynamicPageList3\Query::buildAndSelect: The DynamicPageList3 extension (version 3.6.1) produced a SQL statement which led to a Database error.<br/>The reason may be an internal error of DynamicPageList3 or an error that you made; especially when using parameters like 'categoryregexp' or 'titleregexp'. Usage of non-greedy <code>*?</code> matching patterns are not supported.<br/>The err]] |
This is embarrassing...
...but we completely forgot to rename this page! This power should never have been called neurocognitive deficit in the first place for the same reasons given in talk:mental manipulation. "Lobotomization" might be a bit awkward but fits and is near-canon; is it an adequate choice?--Referos 19:11, 1 December 2009 (EST)
- We didn't forget anything. Anna has a different ability than the Haitian so those reasons don't apply. See above reasons why lobotomization doesn't work.--MiamiVolts (talk) 19:26, 1 December 2009 (EST)
- Wasn't the original reason the fact that it's speculative to say that "neurocognitive deficit" in the Mozaic file was referring to Anna's / René's ability? Similar to matching "Dynamic camouflage" from the Genesis files with invisibility? Even if the Anna and René have different abilities, shouldn't this same reason still hold?--Referos 19:47, 1 December 2009 (EST)
- Actually, it was clarified that we don't know what the terms in the Mozaic file were referring to--so to discuss whether or not it is speculation that the term was referring to an ability is meaningless. It does help that it is a term used in the show, but what matters most is that neurocognitive deficit is a good descriptive term for the ability that we agreed not to oppose. Those terms for René's and Claude's abilities are a different case as they don't seem to cover all aspects of the ability they are supposed to describe. In René's discussion, we noted that he has two unique aspects to his ability so "neurocognitive deficit" would not necessarily apply. "Dynamic camouflage" doesn't apply to Claude's ability as light seemed to pass through him when he was invisible (camouflage still creates shadows), and also invisibility seems to be the more common/accurate term).--MiamiVolts (talk) 21:14, 1 December 2009 (EST)
- Wasn't the original reason the fact that it's speculative to say that "neurocognitive deficit" in the Mozaic file was referring to Anna's / René's ability? Similar to matching "Dynamic camouflage" from the Genesis files with invisibility? Even if the Anna and René have different abilities, shouldn't this same reason still hold?--Referos 19:47, 1 December 2009 (EST)