This wiki is a XML full dump clone of "Heroes Wiki", the main wiki about the Heroes saga that has been shut down permanently since June 1, 2020. The purpose of this wiki is to keep online an exhaustive and accurate database about the franchise.

Talk:Electric manipulation

From Heroes Wiki
Revision as of 05:09, 15 November 2007 by imported>Ice Vision (→A true analogy)
Jump to navigation Jump to search

Title photo

I must say, good choice for the title photo. I was torn between something like this and electric kiss.--MiamiVolts (talk) 00:36, 14 November 2007 (EST)

Lightning?

Come on, you have to be kidding me. Lightning?!?! Is that the best name you all can create? Exactly what was wrong with Electromagnestism?--The Empath 13:43, 14 November 2007 (EST)

  • The writers said it didn't apply to Elle's power in a Behind the Eclipse.--MiamiVolts (talk) 13:49, 14 November 2007 (EST)
    • But still everyone here can come up with a better name than "Lightning".--The Empath 13:51, 14 November 2007 (EST)
      • It's not a matter of "coming up" with anything. Lightning has been used repeatedly in canonical and near canonical sources to refer to the ability. Until Mohinder decides to give it another name, it's the term that has to be used. (Admin 14:36, 14 November 2007 (EST))
        • Plus they never explicitly stated that electrokinesis or anything else was the proper name for it, they just prefered it when given the choice between it or electromagnetism. All other powers have been given proper names either in the show or by the show's staff. A good example is that originally Peter's power was just called power mimicry before getting the word empath added. --PeterDawson 14:54, 14 November 2007 (EST)
          • I think Lightning is the best name for it, especially in light of Four Months Ago.... Clearly (to me, anyway), Elle releases lightning bolts from her fingers (and mouth).--  Lost Soul   talk  contribs  14:56, 14 November 2007 (EST)
            • If its not a matter of "coming up" with a name then where the hell did you get the name Electromagnetism? I don't recall it being called that in the graphic novel or on screen.--The Empath 21:44, 14 November 2007 (EST)
              • We came up with that name because no name was given for the power. When a name is given, we use it. When no name is given, we consult other sources. When no other sources give it, we generally name it ourselves. See Help:Naming conventions#Power Names for a full breakdown on the process. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 21:51, 14 November 2007 (EST)
  • Look, what I want to point out is the only difference between the Agent using this power and Elle using it is that the Agent uses it to levitate some and Elle doesn't. Other than that, the powers are THE SAME. Your descriptions for the powers on the pages are simular there for making the powers simular. I'm trying to say is that you should make some distinction between them or IMO combine them back and call the power "Electricity Manipulation".--The Empath 22:04, 14 November 2007 (EST)
    • I'm not educated in the powers of Elle, but the production of lightning has to do with the separation of extremely different charges of atoms or particles within the air. Meaning that Elle MUST have control over the polarization of those particles. Thus, an appropriate name could be Electric Manipulation. I agree with The Empath in such that if two different articles have the same discription or definition, that is terms for merging the two articles. Repetition is not good. Electromagnetism refers to controlling the polariztion of particles so that they attract to each other. This makes the names of the abilities the same...but Electromagnetism gives a very specific sense of her ability and does not capture it as a whole.--Free Willy 22:15, 14 November 2007 (EST)
    • The ability to levitate or not is a pretty big difference. Other abilities are similar (Linderman's and Claire's) but not the same. The distinction we've made is separating the powers since they're not the same. Joe Pokaski and Aron Coleite have said as much. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 22:35, 14 November 2007 (EST)
      • Its Electrical Manipulation or Electrokinesis... Look at any comic book website. Really, if you Look at Johnny Ohm from Marvel Nemesis: Rise of the Imperfects (the videogame) he has this exact power we are talking about and its just one ability. Put it in one category or change one of the definitions so at least they are not the same. --.Vault 22:43, 14 November 2007 (EST)
        • The Lightning page has the "Ability to" as to generate electrical energy. One can create electrical energy without creating/causing lightning! The elctromagnetism page says this: Manipulate and/or generate electrostatic energy. These are the same. This either needs to be changed to make a distinction between the two or I vote to remerge the articles.--Free Willy 22:48, 14 November 2007 (EST)
          • I second that. They are clearly the same abilities, I don't know why you all don't see that.--The Empath 22:49, 14 November 2007 (EST)
          • See User:Heroe/electromagnetically-based abilities for a compare-and-contrast of this ability and electromagnetism. --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 22:59, 14 November 2007 (EST)
            • They are not the same ability. I tend to take the writers' words above my own ideas, the consensus of other fans, and certainly over comic books which exist in a different world than Heroes. To see what the writers have to say about it (specifically that say it's not the same power), see here. For a discussion on the split, see here. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 22:56, 14 November 2007 (EST)
            • Ignoring for a moment the fact that the writers stated that Elle's power doesn't include magnetism, if they were indeed the same power then the term that must be used for both has to be lightning. That term has been used canonically to describe Elle's (and Peter's) power. There is no other option for the name of that power in that instance. The reason for the split was because the term lightning didn't seem to best describe what the agent was exhibiting since he also levitated (plus the writers explicitly said her power didn't involve electromagnetism). If it were the same power Elle and Peter will be able to use the power of lightning to levitate, but to make that claim seemed more speculative (since it's not yet been observed) so the powers were split just to play it safe. When in doubt and when there is no canonical reference that states otherwise it is safer to split powers into two articles rather than claim that they're the same exact power. (Admin 23:04, 14 November 2007 (EST))
  • Dude here is what it says: Peter continues, On a small side note, are Elle's powers just electricity or is it electro-magnetism? A guy who appeared in the comics had electro-magnetism, so I'm just curious if it's the exact same power or just good old electrokinesis. Good old electrokinesis. She's no Magneto. More Living Lightning. Yes. We said Living Lightning. Acording to him, the power is "Good old electrokinesis". You've proven that its not Electromagnetism, I rest my case. Then lets call this article Electrokinesis. It's got a source and all so why not? :-) --The Empath 23:10, 14 November 2007 (EST)
    • There's a pretty lengthy discussion, summary, and vote on the subject of calling the power "electrokinesis". Personally, I feel the writers were just repeating the term given to them rather than actually calling the power by that name. But Elle's and the agent's powers are still not necessarily the same powers. They might be different iterations of the same power, or they might be two different powers altogether. Elle does not levitate like the agent does, and that's a pretty big difference. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:29, 14 November 2007 (EST)
    • The only problem I have is that the descriptions must be changed between the two pages, otherwise it seems redundant. Right now the descriptions are EXACTLY the same word for word. Someone who is more knowledgable about why you guys split them in the first place should change one of them. Random guy 23:15, 14 November 2007 (EST)
      • This is also a concern of mine. The descriptions need to be changed in order to discren between the two.--Free Willy 23:17, 14 November 2007 (EST)
        • I don't mind fixing the descriptions, but it seems silly to me to change the infobox description (which is perfectly fine) when the lead text is much more descriptive and specific. I wouldn't mind a tweak, though. However, the more we add levitation to electromagnetism, the more I want to remove the teenage patient and call his power something different altogether. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:24, 14 November 2007 (EST)
          • If thats true then move him to Electrokinesis. Done and done.--The Empath 23:34, 14 November 2007 (EST)
            • We have a name from the writers for his power, too. Mark Sable called it "electrical absorption".--Hardvice (talk) 23:51, 14 November 2007 (EST)
  • Well, I created the article Electrokinesis but it was deleted...Would you like to vote on changing it to Electrokinesis?--The Empath 23:53, 14 November 2007 (EST)
    • Changing what to electrokinesis?--Hardvice (talk) 23:54, 14 November 2007 (EST)
      • This article to Electrokinesis.--The Empath 23:56, 14 November 2007 (EST)
        • No. That ship has sailed. "Lightning" is used in canon sources. "Electrokinesis" was repeated in an interview. Only another canon source name can replace it at this point. See Help:Naming conventions.--Hardvice (talk) 00:00, 15 November 2007 (EST)
          • So then what was stated here doesn't have anything to do with the Heroes cannon?--The Empath 00:05, 15 November 2007 (EST)

A true analogy

Ok lightning is to electromagnetism as Fire is to pyrokinesis. We might as well called Meredith's power "fire". Lighting is just... It doesn't explain the power at all. Does Elle eat lightning? Does she fart lightning? If anything we should say that she "manipulates" it. Lightning is very plain. And it is used in canonical sources but I still think we should add manipulation. I'm going to have to agree with THe Empath. Jason Garrick 23:44, 14 November 2007 (EST)

  • Thank you Jason.--The Empath 23:46, 14 November 2007 (EST)
  • "Lightning" is the name used consistently in the show, in the graphic novels, and in the episode commentaries. We're stuck with it.--Hardvice (talk) 23:51, 14 November 2007 (EST)
  • No offense. but define constantly? In the show they never say that D.L. phases through walls. They say he walks through walls. Then I'll have to vote on walkthroughwallskinesis. Not to be rude or anything but I'm just trying to interpret back to you the logic that your saying. Also, they Haitian's powers are described as a "negation". The name lightning. I'm imagining the pretty yellow line in the sky... Jason Garrick 23:55, 14 November 2007 (EST)
    • They have indeed called D.L.'s power "phasing". Elle has referred to her power as "lightning". Peter tried yelling "lightning" to get it to work. They call it "lightning" several times in a graphic novel called, oddly enough, "Petrified Lightning". Tim Kring called it "lightning" in the episode commentary. So did Greg Beeman. So did Milo Ventimiglia.--Hardvice (talk) 23:58, 14 November 2007 (EST)

"D.L. can phase inside the buildings. Candice's illusion can distract the guards."

- Future Hiro (to Ando) (Five Years Gone)


"Why did you take that bullet? You could've let it phase right through you."

- Niki (to D.L.) (How to Stop an Exploding Man)

--Ice Vision 00:06, 15 November 2007 (EST)

  • What's wrong with simple names? After all, we have flight and persuasion. We're not going to change those anytime soon. --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 00:08, 15 November 2007 (EST)
    • I agree with you. I like simple names, like lightning. Complicated names are too... complicated.--Ice Vision 00:09, 15 November 2007 (EST)
Retrieved from "https://heroeswiki.ddns.net/index.php?title=Talk:Electric_manipulation&oldid=289265"