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Talk:Flight

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Revision as of 17:41, 14 June 2009 by imported>ERROR (→Power name source)
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Ability Naming Conventions
The following sources are used for determining evolved human ability names, in order:
Episodes
2. Near-canon Sources Webisodes,
Graphic Novels,
iStories,
Heroes Evolutions
3. Secondary Sources Episode commentary,
Interviews,
Heroes: Survival
4. Common names for abilities Names from other works
5. Descriptions of abilities Descriptions
6. Possessor's name If no non-speculative
description is possible
Note: The highlighted row represents the level of the source used to determine flight's name.
Source/Explanation
Mohinder explicitly names it "Flight" in The Second Coming.

Wind Manipulation

Could be the possible Power of Nathan to Explain why his body & Clothing is still Intact after his Flight [1]

~ Red = 6:05PM Jan 3, 2007
  • My personal opinion has always been that we're looking too far into the powers. I suspect we're supposed to suspend disbelief... afterall how do you explain through physics how Sylar can pick up and throw a locker door? :) Trying to find explanations (or what I tend to call "consequencial powers") for all the consequences of their powers will, I suspect, lead people to make the wrong assumption about the nature of the person's powers. Does Jessica have super-durability? It would require that in order to be able to rip a door off of a safe without breaking every bone in your hand. However, I'm willing to bet that if Jessica ever got shot in the hand it would go right through. Just my personal take on it. :) (Admin 18:17, 3 January 2007 (EST))
    • The Final Vision that Peter Had in Chapter 11 "Fallout" where Nathan steps close to Peter and a rush of Air Blows up; It could be Nathan's Power along with Peter going Critical mass.
~ Red = 02:35, 4 January 2007
      • This would explain the middle school boy's deoxygenation in the future, perhaps he also have Aerokenisis and used it take away air.
~ Rybo5000 = 12:11, 31 July 2008

Main Image

The main image should really be a picture of the originator of the power, in my opinion. I really like the picture of Nathan flying, even if you can't see him. There are better pictures of him from Genesis if we wanted to use one of those ... but I don't see anything wrong with the one we have. — RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 21:41, 9 May 2007 (EDT)

  • I was hoping for something in which the user was more than a dot, and the image I was at least Nathan in appearance (theoretically). If we can find one in which he is flying and recognizable (as opposed to a dot or a blur), that would be my preference. --Ted C 22:03, 9 May 2007 (EDT)

I think the main image should be this picture. It really shows flight and we did see him before West. --Catalyst 20:43, 20 January 2009 (EDT)

That's not a bad picture either. I was confused about why we were using West as well. I mean, when you think of "flight," the first thing that comes to mind isn't really "hovering." At least, just for me. We could also use a picture of Peter, as well. My main suggestions are this one or this one.Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 21:50, 20 January 2009 (EST)

I like the first picture you chose there. of Peter carrying Claude. That really does show flight. --Catalyst 20:26 21 January 2009

Alright, here is an image of the original holder, Nathan, flying. Not a dot and in the air. You can clearly see the street far below him. Let's change the picture of West to this.--Catalyst

Talk 06:53, 14 March 2009 (EDT)

    • brighten it up a smidge and I think it would be fine, as it is now, it a little dark and you cant see things very well --SacValleyDweller (talk) 01:35, 22 March 2009 (EDT)
      • Someone please brighten up this picture. I have no idea how to do it, so someone else has to.--Catalyst 11:53 23,March 2009
        • Alright, i just keep messing up. the second reversion is brighter, but for whatever reason it didn't show up that way. so i tried to do it again and again. someone please help.--Catalyst 17:46 23,March 2009

"Originally Held By"

Well... how do we work with this with multiple people sharing a power... aside from those who've absorbed? Noone can say who manifested their power earlier, so we can't say Nathan is original over West. On top of that, West seems to fly much smoother, like a bird - Nathan shoots off like a rocket. Maybe we actually have two different forms of flight here? --Riddler 22:59, 24 September 2007 (EDT)

  • We can list multiple people under "originally held by". It technically means more along the lines of "natively held by". It's just making a distinction between people who have the powers naturally and those who stole (Sylar) or mimic (Peter) them. (Admin 23:02, 24 September 2007 (EDT))
    • -Salutes- Aye Aye, Sir.--Riddler 23:03, 24 September 2007 (EDT)

On a related note, we had a policy of having the infobox image be one of the first person in the series to manifest the power on screen. Given that we may not have a better image of Nathan in flight, do we want to relax that rule? --Ted C 14:36, 3 October 2007 (EDT)


Limits Separated by user

  • Really like this change. Much simpler and clearer.--Hardvice (talk) 17:20, 16 October 2007 (EDT)
    • Agreed. Should we do this for other powers when there seems to be a difference? STM can use it, I would think (with Future Peter and Hiro).--Bob (Talk) 17:23, 16 October 2007 (EDT)
      • I've implemented this change at space-time manipulation. It's a little different there because it involves Future characters as well as regular characters. --Ted C 17:50, 16 October 2007 (EDT)

Levitation

I think that levitation would be a more appropriate name.

levitation (noun) 1. the phenomenon of a person or thing rising into the air by apparently supernatural means 2. movement upward in virtue of lightness

Not only is this term a well known term for what Nathan and West can do, but it is also used in the show. Mohinder mentions evolved humans who can levitate several times. So I vote we change the name to levitation because it is a term used on the show, and sounds more official than flight. --phoenixautumn 15:54, 7 November 2007 (EST)

Anybody going to discuss this? --phoenixautumn 13:49, 9 November 2007 (EST)

  • I also like the word levitation, but I would rather use the word flight. You say the name should be changed because the show uses the term levitation. Sorry to burst your bubble, but a lot more characters have used the word "fly". "You can fly?!"; "I think I can fly!"; "Flying man!"; and so on and so forth... They keep saying "fly."--Ice Vision 15:58, 9 November 2007 (EST)
    • Well true, but people also say to Claire "you can heal?", and yet her power is not healing, but rapid cell regeneration. And Matt says "I can read minds" and yet his power isn't mind reading, it's telepathy. So what I'm saying is that people say things like flying, healing, and mind-reading because it's simpler terms, whereas levitation is more of a technical term.

--phoenixautumn 14:11, 9 November 2007 (EST)

  • Also, for most people, levitation equals lift. It does not necessarily equal propulsion. Look at your definition: "rising into the air", "movement upward". There's no indication of an ability to travel forward--just an ability to hover.--Hardvice (talk) 16:09, 9 November 2007 (EST)
    • I agree with Hardvice. Levitation just describes hovering, whereas flight shows their actual movement through the air; they are not just levitating, they are flying. In my opinion.--  Lost Soul   talk  contribs  16:14, 9 November 2007 (EST)
      • Here are some other definitions. All support the levitation=hovering, flight=movement divide:
        • "To rise or cause to rise into the air and float in apparent defiance of gravity." (American Heritage)
        • "the process by which an object is suspended against gravity, in a stable position, by a force without physical contact." (Wikipedia)
        • "the raising or rising of a body in air by supernatural means." (Random House unabridged)
In contrast, "Flight" is:
  • "The motion of an object in or through a medium, especially through the earth's atmosphere or through space." (American Heritage)
  • "the process by which an object achieves sustained movement ... through the air" (Wikipedia)
--Hardvice (talk) 16:22, 9 November 2007 (EST)
    • Alright well thanks for clearing that up for me. I does make sense now. I still think that levitation sounds better, but you're right, that term is too limited and doesn't imply moving through the air. Thanx. --phoenixautumn 18:44, 9 November 2007 (EST)

Different versions of flight

I think we shouldn't assume that West gained his ability naturally. We don't know when that practice of artificially inducing abilities stopped. Also, we are assuming Nathan has the same version of the ability as West...and as Ryan reminded me, the fact that Nathan is capable of supersonic flight isn't proof of a different version as West may be similarly capable but not know it (the fact that West has much more experience is irrelevant).--MiamiVolts (talk) 22:03, 22 October 2008 (EDT)

  • Likewise, we shouldn't assume that he didn't gain his ability naturally. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 22:43, 22 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Agreed. I think I've removed the speculation without adding any.--MiamiVolts (talk) 22:55, 22 October 2008 (EDT)

Power name source

For the Power names template, Ryan noted: One of the folders in the Genesis Files is labeled "Human Flight Potential". In Genesis, Peter says, "So I went to the library to see if I could find anything on human flight." Then he reads from Activating Evolution itself: "Genes determine obesity, blood pressure. Out of the 30 billion possibilities, one might contain the potential for human flight."--MiamiVolts (talk) 20:42, 24 October 2008 (EDT)

  • Now, I'm against using that as the source. Though the Genesis Files could potentially pertain to them, they didn't directly link Peter or Nathan's abilities to flight, and neither Peter nor Nathan say that "flight" is their ability...they did both say that they can "fly", so I think the current source is fine as-is.--MiamiVolts (talk) 20:42, 24 October 2008 (EDT)
    • I'd agree with that personally, though accepting this is a clear platform for arguing that it's ok to make minor grammatical changes to make the names fit. Which, as I've stated before, I support. However it's only fair for me to disclose this point. :) If you ask yourself whether we shouldn't be able to call it flight just because they didn't happen to use the word in part of a sentence that necessitated it it's kind of odd to me. It doesn't change the word, it's just a different usage of it in the sentence and as a result it should be covered by the aspect of our convention where we determine tense, plurality, etc. instead. (Admin 21:27, 24 October 2008 (EDT))

If we're allowed to do that, why is puppet master still puppet master?--ERROR 13:41, 14 June 2009 (EDT)

Usage

I am really hoping they start to use this ability more often, it is one of my favorites and I like watching Nathan and Peter fly. Those two move pretty fast, while every other example of flight seems kind of weak. Bring back supersonic flight soon please! (Alchemist 16:56, 28 October 2008 (EDT))

Shouldn't it be: Human Flight Potential?

  • I'm confused. You guys based the name of the ability from Peter's words, while the name of the abiltiy is all over the List in Suresh's folders and stuff.

I know you are gonna say that this is what Peter said, but I can't help but remember, Micah also stated that his Mom have "Super strength", but then you changed it to 'Enhanced Strength' because its what's written in HRG's computer...I'm confused....--NiveKJ13 20:00, 21 November 2008 (EST)

    • HFP and Flight are in the same level in the ability naming convention, I guess flight was chosen cause it's simpler. Intuitive Empath 20:03, 21 November 2008 (EST)
      • Actually, flight was chosen because Peter said he can fly. The Genesis files including 'Human Flight Potential' didn't have much to do with it as they were never directly connected with Peter or Nathan. Flight also happens to be a common name for the ability, but that's not why it was originally so named.--MiamiVolts (talk) 20:07, 21 November 2008 (EST)
        • If the Mosaic file is related to Peter, then Human Flight Potential should really be meaning the potential for a person to have human flight. Therefore flight is the ability, HFP is the potential to have the ability, or it could mean that one potentially already has the ability.--FlamingTomDude 23:23, 3 December 2008 (EST)
          • At any rate, Mohinder also named it "Flight" explicitly in The Second Coming, so there's no need to change.--Referos 14:32, 21 January 2009 (EST)

Revision to what I did

Yes, I agree, but it was done wrong and the whole sentence was italicized so I fixed that but forgot to fix the italics on the title of the episode.--WarGrowlmon18 23:21, 25 February 2009 (EST)

Fight or Flight?

Alter added "One interesting note is that Nathan seems to fly involuntarily in danger." followed by Nathan's first manifestation and when he was forced to reveal himself as an evolved human for Danko. Did he really did it out of reflex or was it a conscious choice? I watched the episode only once, but it seemed to me that Nathan flew because he wanted, can someone verify that? Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 12:36, 11 March 2009 (EDT)

  • The way I see it is that it's simply a reflex now, akin to when you are about to hit the ground you brace yourself for impact. He simply flies instead of bracing himself. That and he would have died had he hit the ground.--Steely McBeam - (talk) 12:43, 11 March 2009 (EDT)
    • He still had to fall quite a distance to hit the ground, enough for him to use his ability consciously. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 13:45, 22 March 2009 (EDT)

New Main Image?

What do people think of this shot of Nathan flying for the main image? http://heroeswiki.com/Image:Powers_flight_SOG.JPG I like it, I think it's a great "flying" shot and not just "hovering", and be great as the main image. I also like the idea of the main image being from the original "flying man!" --Powermimic 22:32, 22 March 2009 (EDT)

  • Except for the black line on top, I like it. Looks good. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 22:35, 22 March 2009 (EDT)
  • I love the New image but could someone get a copy how the same screen but it moving, same with Shape-shifting?-skyeatsout

I LOVE this new image. Very intense. Kudos to whoever chose it. --Peter 17:17, 7 April 2009 (EDT)

Quote

I think

"Ya know, they say girls are attracted to men just like their father."

"...you mean because he can fly..."

"No, i mean her real father"

-Sandra and Noah (Cautionary Tales)

should be included in the quote section. --NuparuMahnika 05:02, 7 April 2009 (EDT)

  • Not so sure about that one....what does it say about the power itself? --Crazylicious 17:23, 7 April 2009 (EDT)

an invisble thread reference.

OK, WHICH IDIOT PUT THAT SYLAR STOLE THIS ABILITY FROM NATHAN IN AN INVISIBLE THREAD.I AM ANGRY. THIS HAS NOT BEEN CONFIRMED YET!--Sly 22:27, 27 April 2009 (EDT)

  • Nobody here is an idiot; it's an on going discussion and all theories are valid. I think we should just make a note that Sylar appeared to be using flight, with the disclaimer that it might have just been advanced telekinesis. Then we should do the same for the telekinesis page (only, you know, reversed). --Crazyaspie 23:10, 28 April 2009 (EDT)
  • Given it had the flight sound effect it sounds like you might have to eat your words.
  • Ok, flight sound effect = flight. If that's the case, Sylar has puppet master. Both Sylar and Matt have invisiblity. Jessica has the ability teleportation. Charles doesn't have telepathy. The haitian has teleportation, just like jessica. That's what happen if you judge on sound effects. --JLYK 12:43, 2 May 2009 (EDT)
  • Also, if you can remember Sylar had decided to kill people to gain their abilities. He couldn't have stolen it from Nathan as Nathan was still alive when he was levitating also Nathan died before Sylar had the chance to take it. -- By Leckie at 06:33, 3 June 2009 (EDT)

Yes, through empathy. This is what I believe.

And yes, Elle really did die eventually, but Sylar initially used "empathy" to get her ability.--ERROR 13:25, 14 June 2009 (EDT)

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