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Talk:Shanti virus

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Page Idea

So there exists a disease in the Heroes 'verse that affects Evolved Humans, and has aflicted 3 people: Shanti, Molly, and the latest victem, the dying patient from Blackout. This thing might affect others in the future. Terefore, I think an article on it is, or soon will be, warranted. What say everyone else?--SacValleyDweller 19:06, 4 September 2007 (EDT)

  • See Shanti virus. --DocM 19:11, 4 September 2007 (EDT)
    • gotchya, gonna make a redirect to that, then.--SacValleyDweller 19:15, 4 September 2007 (EDT) And this can be deleted.--SacValleyDweller 19:24, 4 September 2007 (EDT)
      • No, I'll just combine this conversation with the other one, and then have a redirect. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 19:28, 4 September 2007 (EDT)

Mainspace

Hey, I see you are starting something here, that I was just planning to do myself. Are you starting this out as a 'userpage', with the intent on making it a real-page when you get it all fixed up? I have been doing research through pics and the transcripts on references regarding this. Would you mind if I added in additional things I have found on it? --HiroDynoSlayer (talk) 09/4/2007 11:27 (EST)

  • This page will (hopefully) become main once it's all sorted and what-not. You can add whatever you want to it. --DocM 11:30, 4 September 2007 (EDT)

Item?

Um, how exactly is this item? --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 20:34, 5 September 2007 (EDT)

  • Do you have another suggestion? I agree, it's odd, but it doesn't really fit anywhere else. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 22:06, 5 September 2007 (EDT)
  • I think item works. A virus is a physical thing. It's not one you can see or touch but it's real. I guess we could make a category called Microscopic things and add both the Shanti virus and Dr. Strauss virus?--MiamiVolts (talk) 22:44, 5 September 2007 (EDT)
    • Let's make sure we don't create an infobox category just for the sake of having a category. A corollary to that is that we try not to create arbitrary infobox categories with the sole purpose of being able to put multiple things into it, but instead one that provides a useful grouping of a large number of articles that are fundamentally different and therefore require a completely different set of variables. I think it's ok for us to leave it as an item for now. The most logical future infobox would probably be "diseases", but I don't think we have enough articles to warrant it yet. (Admin 22:53, 5 September 2007 (EDT))
    • That being said, I'd say either "Item" or "Thing" is most appropriate for this article. I'm leaning more towards "Thing" as it's more generic, but Item works just as well. (Admin 22:55, 5 September 2007 (EDT))
      • Actually, as I'm thinking about it, I think it should just go under Portal:Research. Not all the articles there are forced into another portal. For instance, algorithm and the list reside in research and that's about it. I think the Shanti virus would be fine in there, too. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:17, 5 September 2007 (EDT)
        • That's a much better fit. And actually, the virus probably belongs in the research series box, too, since it was the focus of Chandra's research for some time.--Hardvice (talk) 23:21, 5 September 2007 (EDT)
          • Again, as I said, I like "item" better than "thing" cause a virus is a physical thing. You can tell with a microscope that a microbe is there. The "things" portal contains abstract stuff like the symbols and markings. And I don't like labelling a biological entity as a research item (that's why I moved it out of "research" to begin with), but I'm okay with being out-voted ;) PS: if we do later decide to add a new portal for diseases, we could stretch it (yeah, it would be a stretch given the limited info we have) by adding "Claire's chromosomal disease", "Sandra's brain damage" and "Charlie's brain tumor", in addition to my already mentioned "Shanti virus" and "Dr. Strauss's virus"--that's a max five thus far.--MiamiVolts (talk) 23:34, 5 September 2007 (EDT)
            • Right, if there are a bunch of diseases, sicknesses, etc. later on, then we could rearrange. But I agree with Admin, I don't want to create articles or categories just to "fill spaces". But while we have what we have, I think the virus best fits under research, especially considering that it was not only the impetus for Chandra's research, but was pretty much the only thing he even had to research for a number of years. I'll go ahead and make the change now. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 23:40, 5 September 2007 (EDT)
              • I agree, definitely belongs with Chandra's other research. (Admin 23:43, 5 September 2007 (EDT))
                • When I made the article, I added the research template. So, I agree. Fine fit. --DocM 09:29, 6 September 2007 (EDT)
          • Would this also fit under The Company category?--Shoreline83 18:58, 28 November 2007 (EST)

Note: (Speculative?) All known victims of the disease have been evolved humans

In the notes section, it lists the three victims, then makes what I believe is a speculative comment afterwards (since it has never been confirmed in canon, that Shanti was an evolved human.


  • The characters who have been infected by the virus are:
Dying patient (Blackout, Part 1)
Shanti Suresh (Homecoming, Six Months Ago, The Hard Part)
Molly Walker (The Hard Part)
  • To date, all known victims of the disease have been evolved humans.


Shouldn't the second note above, be removed for speculation? It is assuming Shanti is an Evolved Human. --HiroDynoSlayer (talk) 09/7/2007 12:06 (EST)

  • You're right, it should be removed. We don't classify Shanti as an evolved human yet, so that statement wouldn't be accurate. (Admin 12:18, 7 September 2007 (EDT))
  • Good catch. I think Ted was trying to get rid of the speculation that the virus affects only EHs, while still preserving the integrity of the evidence. I didn't catch that, either. Good job. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 14:13, 7 September 2007 (EDT)

Niki?

  • In one of the episode commentaries, apparently it mentions that Niki has this virus. Should this be included? (I'm thinking not because it hasn't been confirmed in-show, but I thought I'd ask.)--  Lost Soul   talk  contribs  14:19, 31 October 2007 (EDT)
    • You are correct. It should be in Notes, not in the main body of the article.--Hardvice (talk) 14:34, 31 October 2007 (EDT)
      • It's pretty much confirmed now in-show.--MiamiVolts (talk) 15:27, 8 November 2007 (EST)

Disambig?

So can we add a new disambig page now for virus? There's at least three now:

  1. Shanti virus -- the one which infected Shanti Suresh and now several others.
  2. Maya's virus -- it's more of an ability, but it has been compared to a virus.
  3. Dr. Strauss's virus -- Hana was sent last year to obtain info. about his work.

Any others I missed?--MiamiVolts (talk) 15:27, 8 November 2007 (EST)

  • Maya's ability hasn't been confirmed as a virus yet, so it should probably be left off. There is also the virus that killed Hana. -Lөvөl 16:32, 8 November 2007 (EST)
    • Good addition with Hana's virus. I forgot about that one. As for Maya's ability, I think it should be included in the disambig since it is being compared to one.--MiamiVolts (talk) 16:37, 8 November 2007 (EST)
      • As long as it's worded clearly enough to avoid speculation, it should be included. Probably something along the lines of "Maya's ability, which causes a fatal sickness in its victims." That way, any claim that it is or isn't a virus is avoided, while still allowing for the fact that some fans refer to it as a virus.--Hardvice (talk) 17:19, 8 November 2007 (EST)
        • We don't know it's a fatal sickness though. It can just be a fatality without a sickness. I mean, yes it's being referred to in interviews and such, but it's still purely speculation, and we shouldn't include it until it's confirmed.--Riddler 17:27, 8 November 2007 (EST)
          • People can sicken from a virus, a toxin, radiation, infection, shock, or any cause. Sickness does not necessarily mean disease or virus. Her victims visibly sicken.--Hardvice (talk) 19:57, 8 November 2007 (EST)
  • virus (disambig). -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 20:48, 8 November 2007 (EST)
    • Thanks, Ryan. It's nicely worded.--MiamiVolts (talk) 21:35, 8 November 2007 (EST)

The Shanti Virus didn't kill Shanti

The Virus that killed Shanti can't be the plague that scourges humanity in the second future reality. Mohinder's sister died from a disease that was similar to that what is now called "the Shanti Virus". But there's one significant difference between the two of them: The SV is a mutation of the original one and due to that immune to Mohinder's blood-transfusion-treatment. So you can't say that Shanti was the first one to die from the Virus. This should be mentioned in the article. --BloodyFox, 9 Nov 2007, 13:44 (CEST)

  • Sure we can say that the Shanti virus is what killed Shanti. Even if there's a mutation, it's still considered the Shanti virus. As far as I understand, we don't name every strain and mutation of the common cold. I think it's a good idea to say that the virus has mutated, but I don't think there are two different viruses any more than Maury and Matt have two different powers. They're just in different stages. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 08:55, 9 November 2007 (EST)
    • Well but the original Shanti Virus only affected evolved humans while the mutated one is a pathogene for "normal" humans as well. It's somehow like a cold evolving into a flew. --BloodyFox, 9 Nov 2007, 15:03 (CEST)
      • In Out of Time in the future the man who brings Peter in to see his mother does still call it "the Shanti virus". So despite the mutation they're still calling it the same thing. (Admin 09:35, 9 November 2007 (EST))
      • Not so fast. As far as I remember they never called the Virus that killed Mohinder's Sister the Shanti Virus, they just came up with it refering to the plague. Or am I mistaken? --BloodyFox, 9 Nov 2007, 15:38 (CEST)
        • In Out of Time, Howard Lemay does refer to it specifically as "the Shanti virus" if that's what you're asking. And in recent episodes they have called the one just affecting evolved humans "the Shanti virus" as well. Bob said it at least once I do remember. (Admin 09:44, 9 November 2007 (EST))
        • Bob refers to the new virus as "a variant of the Shanti virus". That means the old virus was called "the Shanti virus". Howard refers to the new virus as "the Shanti virus". Both new and old strains are called the same thing, and that's not even slightly uncommon. Humans and evolved humans aren't separate species, even, and lots of illnesses keep their names when crossing from one species to another, let alone from one subset of the population to another.--Hardvice (talk) 15:08, 9 November 2007 (EST)
          • You're wrong, Hardvice, concerning the fact, that humans and evolved humans aren't seen as separate species. At least in terms of heroes-logic. Mohinder tells Sylar (disguised as Nathan) in Five Years Gone that he can't change who they are "...it's hard coded in their DNA. It's like they're a different species!". So I think you at least have to admit that I'm right on this one... --BloodyFox, 10 Nov 2007, 01:54(CEST)
            • The operative word there being "like". --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 20:21, 9 November 2007 (EST)
              • Exactly. A bull mastiff and a rat terrier are "like" different species. They aren't actually different species. Humans and evolved humans interbreed and cross all the time. Non-evolved parents have evolved children and seemingly vice-versa. They are genetically different from one another, but there's no way they are actually a different species.--Hardvice (talk) 23:47, 9 November 2007 (EST)

Adam has the virus, and spreads it to people, with his blood?

Maybe him, and Peter go to 'heal' people, and he has it, or he goes public with his 'curing blood' and donates alot of it? Just a suggestion, knowing my luck, this is probably the wrong place xD K00bes 11:50, 21 November 2007 (EST)

Hold up! Is this a blood or nervous system disease?

we have the top paragraph saying it affects the blood, but nowhere in the episodic history does it affect the blood. there it affects the nervous system. which is it?--SacValleyDweller (talk) 18:12, 24 December 2007 (EST)

  • Well, I don't know if this helps. Here's a conversation.

"Her nucleotides are decomposing. You need to get her to a doctor."

"A doctor can't help her. I'm thinking maybe you can."

"I'm a geneticist. I wouldn't know the first thing about this."

"Molly's virus is very rare. It's destroying her nervous system. Prevents her from accessing her ability."

- Mohinder, Thompson (The Hard Part)

--Ice Vision (talk)

Non Lethal Strain?

The strain that Niki and Sylar had wasn't going to kill them? Mohinder and the others sure acted like Niki was going to die if she wasn't treated. Conduit 18:42, 2 February 2008 (EST)

  • Hmm...... We did say it wasn't lethal for some reason, though that reason escapes me at the moment. For now I'll reword that.--SacValleyDweller (talk) 19:38, 2 February 2008 (EST)
    • I'm not sure why the non-lethal aspect was in there, either, but it's best to take it out. The way it's worded now (which is really good) doesn't say it's lethal and doesn't say it's not lethal. Much better. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 19:57, 2 February 2008 (EST)
      • Niki did say this: "I have a virus. You don't have to worry. I can't make you or anybody else sick." But I guess that only pertains to Niki spreading the virus. --Ice Vision (talk) 20:02, 2 February 2008 (EST)
        • That makes perfect sense. It also explains how we would have misinterpreted it. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 20:03, 2 February 2008 (EST)

Restoration of Sylar's Powers

Was I Am Become Death proof enough of Sylar having (at least some) of his acquired powers restored? He showed precognition and induced radioactivity, and if Claire + Mohinder's blood "vaccine" brought his Telekinesis back, it seems logical that the rest came back (eventually) as well. I agree with this page that he lost all of them due to the virus, but I think it's pretty clear now that they have been restored. GabrielPatrelli 15:06, 13 October 2008 (EDT)

  • I also note that this has been somewhat discussed on Sylar's talk page. I agree with the post there that the episode material trumps interview answers. It seems highly unlikely that Sylar happened to run into (and then steal abilities from) evolved humans who conveniently all had the same abilities he USED to possess. GabrielPatrelli 15:12, 13 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Hrmm, I just read the interview questions from Admin's Talk Page... They were done prior to I Am Become Death, but they seem pretty clear about it... I'm going to make a note then that while Future Sylar seems to have gotten the powers restored, it is not 100% confirmed when and/or how.
      • If the "vaccine" made from Claire's + Mohinder's blood didn't restore any powers beyond Intuitive Aptitude and Telekinesis, could taking Claire's power (done right after that Sylar tells Claire he "lost" everything and had to start over) have allowed him to restore the rest?
        • It is a fact that the virus does not take away powers, it only supresses them in a manner that stops them from useing their powers. in the cases of Sylar his powers may be gone for the moment but they are still hard-wierd into his DNA, as they are with all 'specials'.
          • Still it makes no sense for it to "delete" abilities. The way I understood it was that it suppressed the abilities. This is simply a case of the writers ignoring fact and depowering Sylar to make it far more interesting than a character still at full potential, killing.--Steely McBeam - (talk) 07:45, 8 March 2009 (EDT)

Intuitive aptitude

  • I changed it for now, ut would like to open discussions about it. What I removed stated that Sylar could use his intuitive aptitude while infected with the Shanti virus, using his apparent understanding of Maya's ability and claim that he displayed the "hunger" after killing Candice as evidence. I can't recall those exact circumstances, but there is a good amount of counter-evidence to this claim. First, he was unable to take Candice's power, which implies he does not have access to the power, since intuitive aptitude is what he uses to acquire other evolved humans' abilities. Second, it was stated (iirc) several times in interviews that after Sylar was cured, he regained only his base ability (IA) and telekinesis. If he never lost IA, this would be a false statement as one can only regain something once it has been lost. Sylar himself tells Alejandro that he doesn't have his ability, and that when he does regain it, he will kill both he and his sister (and that even if he is unable to regain it, he will still use Maya as a weapon). My questions would be what to do about these seeming contradictions (though I've already done something for the moment ;)); if his desire to gain Candice's power constitutes the hunger, and if his claim that he understands how Maya's ability works (if he wasn't lying) is enough to say he is using IA. --Stevehim 15:05, 2 May 2009 (EDT)

Afflicted character status

I don't think it's a good idea to list the status. While there is only one case, putting the deceased next to Niki would imply that she died due to the Shanti virus, something untrue. While she did die because she didn't have an ability during a moment that it could have saved her life, it doesn't mean that Niki succumbed to the virus. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 12:27, 23 January 2010 (EST)

  • Ah, yes, true. Is there a medical word for when a person dies specifically of a disease he or she contracted? Or perhaps we could try something like (deceased due to unrelated causes)?--Referos 12:36, 23 January 2010 (EST)
    • Due to unrelated causes seems good to me, I don't think that a word to specify cause of death the way you proposed exists. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 12:41, 23 January 2010 (EST)
      • What about (deceased due to unrelated causes) for cases like Niki and (succumbed) for people who died from the disease?--Referos 13:50, 23 January 2010 (EST)