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Talk:Joseph Sullivan

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For some weird reason on Heroes Wiki, it says Ray Park's playing two characters . . . Edgar (Super speed) and Joseph Sullivan (Samuel's brother), but I'm sure he's playing one . . . -- Mike the Man-child!

  • If you have a source saying who plays Edgar, feel free to add it to 'Spoiler:Heroes'. Otherwise, since it's a spoiler, I think it would be okay to leave the speculation as is. I say this not having checked the 'spoiler:heroes' page, so I could be missing something.--MiamiVolts (talk) 00:54, 1 August 2009 (EDT)
    • Now someone's put up Edgar's picture, what even made anyone believe this? -- Mike the Man-child!
      • It's probably just one character, but which one is the right name? Has NBC said anything officially about who he was playing? --Silurian King 09:57, 8 September 2009 (EDT)
        • Ray Park certainly portrays Edgar, where was it said he will portray Joseph Sullivan? Green.gif AltesUTC CH
          • Look what I told you? Joseph is dead and will not be portrayed by Ray Park [1]. I believe Joseph's image should be deleted now. Green.gif AltesUTC CH

Has Hiro's ability?

  • I'm pretty sure I remember hearing Samuel mention that Hiro is "another time traveler" and Edgar says he could replace Joseph... I dunno -- Rocky
    • That would be Arnold. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 20:14, 22 September 2009 (EDT)
      • Okay thanks, I kinda figured it was the old guy Arnold, just wasn't sure. Makes more sense anyway since it would be hard for a time-traveler just to get killed, lol-- Rocky


Joseph hasn't 'appeared', but his coffin and funeral have. Is there any information on him that I missed that still warrants this page, or should it be replaced by one about the character?

Has Empathic Mimicy

From what Samuel said i think its pretty clear that Joseph has it. -Yippee ki ya 02:13, 29 September 2009 (EDT)

  • Either that, or another empathy-related ability. Samuel does seem to be following a pattern here with Hiro and now Peter. Wonder who Claire's supposed to replace?
    • Boy is Samuel going to feel stupid when he finds out that Peter doesn't have the empath ability anymore.--Gibbeynator 06:51, 29 September 2009 (EDT)
      • Who says he doesn't have it?
    • It may be close enough to suit his purposes.--WarGrowlmon18 12:42, 29 September 2009 (EDT)
        • Did Samuel say Joseph was very powerful, or he had multiple abilities, or something similar? I'm not sure I understand why you think he had EM. Green.gif AltesUTC CH
          • He never said what he had, but they are multiple signs that Joseph was an empath: the compass reacting to Peter (perhaps it reacts to people with empathic powers), his reaction about hearing about Peter from Edgar, the fact that he's looking for Peter to apparently take Joseph's place like he did with Hiro and Arnold, little things like that.--WarGrowlmon18 12:59, 29 September 2009 (EDT)
          • Basically, We assume he may have a empathic power, although since it has not been confirmed it's still speculation. :) Gabriel BishopUTC 13:28, 29 September 2009 (EDT)
            • It wasn't even said Joseph had a power at all. Green.gif AltesUTC CH
              • Using information so far, All members of carnival have abilites (Assumed) , The fact he's replacing members , Edgar said he saw "Another Mimic" , Joseph said he's going after someone who could replace his brother, People are assuming he's a mimic including I, but it's still speculation Gabriel BishopUTC 13:42, 29 September 2009 (EDT)

Danko's final kill?

The way Samuel seems intent on having Edgar kill Danko (especially with the "He crossed the line first, not us." line), because Danko had one of the compasses, and because Danko implied while talking to Noah that he was still actively hunting specials, it would appear that Joseph was Danko's final kill before he himself was killed by Edgar. Thoughts? --Ricard Desi (t,c) 09:45, 30 September 2009 (EDT)

  • Quite possible. I think there's a lot that we're going to learn about Joseph and his death. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 11:35, 30 September 2009 (EDT)
  • OK, I'm new here but I was just thinking about the same. How did Danko lay his hands on a compass? I don't see a way more obvious than he took it from Joseph. Pefarkas 13:19, 15 October 2009
  • Well there you have it, from Samuel's mouth. Danko killed Joseph. --Ricard Desi (t,c) 10:48, 10 November 2009 (EST)


So, what do you think Joseph did to convince Suresh to leave? Persuasion? Telepathy? Sheer luck that this is the one time someone has convinced Suresh to give up his research?--Gibbeynator 23:05, 16 November 2009 (EST)

  • Sheer luck this time. Hopefully the upcoming three issue GN arc will reveal his ability.--Ratclaws 23:09, 16 November 2009 (EST)
    • Does not look that way, my friend. Does not look that way.--Gibbeynator 07:13, 17 November 2009 (EST)
      • If he does have an ability (he's a founder of the carnival, so I'm sure he does), I think he'll have one that we have not seen yet. I have no idea why I think this, I just do.--Catalyst · Talk · HL 22:13, 19 November 2009 (EST)

I think that Joseph has mental manipulation because Joseph stopped Doyle's ability. However if Joseph had this ability, i think he would't let Samuel kill him.-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 14:21, 15 December 2009 (EST)

Empathic Manipulation?

So, during tonights episode, Samuel said something along the lines of: "Stop manipulating my emotions" Do you think that this could be Joseph's ability, assuming he even has one. Vampirate68 | Talk | Contribs 21:25, 23 November 2009 (EST)

  • No. I think he just meant in general.--Catalyst · Talk · HL 21:52, 23 November 2009 (EST)
"Empathy, is the capability to share another being's emotions and feelings." Wouldn't it be called Emotion Manipulation instead? (But I understand what you're trying to say xD) I thought about that too but was wondering why he wouldn't use it to stop Samuel from getting angry. (Well that's if he even had that ability) But it was probably just a general statement like Catalyst just said. ^ ^; --Δκυmσ - ταłκ 22:00, 23 November 2009 (EST)

He may not have an ability.--WarGrowlmon18 22:12, 23 November 2009 (EST)

  • His family was at Coyote Sands for some reason. It may be that they somehow knew fetal Samuel would manifest an ability, but I feel like that's unlikely, they were most likely there because Joseph manifested. I also think his ability was empathic manipulation, it would explain how he kept the whole carnival at ease and welcome.--PJDEP 23:44, 23 November 2009 (EST)
    • Didn't everyone say that Joseph had the empath ability, the same ability that Peter had before Fugitives?--Gibbeynator 11:33, 24 November 2009 (EST)
      • Who said this?--Catalyst · Talk · HL 11:34, 24 November 2009 (EST)
        • It was strongly hinted at throughout the season by Samuel's actions and words. His desire to have someone powerful to fill the gap of Joseph's death, his interactions with Peter, Edgar thinking Peter was an empath and saying so to Samuel. It doesn't make sense for him to do that unless Joseph had some kind of powerful ability, and the most likely one is Peter's original one. But Samuel doesn't know that Peter lost that one. -Barbedknives (talk)11:59, 24 November 2009 (EST)
          • Joseph seems to fear Samuel's power, and was easily killed. I know Samuel may very will split the earth in half, but I doubt he would have died so easily if he had multiple abilities. Also, this means that he would most likely have Samuel's extra special terrakinesis, which doesn't seem to be the case.--PJDEP 15:37, 24 November 2009 (EST)
            • I agree. I think emotion manipulation is most likely his power.
              • Well there's no confirmation that he even has a power so we can't put anything down. Sure his family was at Coyote Sands but his mother or father probably had a power for Samuel to get one. Nathan's is synthetic and skipped over him naturally so perhaps it did the same with Joseph, he is the older brother like Nathan. Also, Alice was there and no one knew she had a power until she told Angela, not even her parents seemed to know. A better question is why were Samuel and his family released before the deaths of everyone at Coyote Sands when they seemed to be keeping everyone there??? Joseph clearly said that they were released.--WarGrowlmon18 19:08, 24 November 2009 (EST)
                • PJDEP, I believe you are mistaken about what I said. I didn't say Empathic Mimicry, but Empathic MANIPULATION, two completely different abilities. Vampirate68 | Talk | Contribs 19:11, 24 November 2009 (EST)
                  • Didn't I say that? Sorry, I feel stupid now xP.--PJDEP 22:16, 25 November 2009 (EST)

Status of having an ability

Although it's extremely likely that Joseph has an ability, it's not confirmed. Being a member of the carnival is not enough--Samuel was very clear (when speaking with Gretchen) that the carnival accepts all kinds. Being a member of a family with abilities is not enough, either. And though he was at Coyote Sands, that's not enough either since he was a child and may have been there simply because his parents were there. Ultimately, it's very obvious he has a power, but not confirmed. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 04:35, 5 December 2009 (EST)

  • With that said, would it atleast be note worthy? Say something like even though an ability has not been seen it's very likely because of such and such. --OutbackZack 04:37, 5 December 2009 (EST)
    • In the Notes section? Yeah, I think that's just fine. But the infobox needs to say "None" for his powers, and he needs to be categorized as a human. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 04:41, 5 December 2009 (EST)
      • It's probably not going to be revealed until Peter goes to the carnival, gets poofed back in time to see what happened, and takes Joseph's ability, giving him his old ability back. Please, writers, make it happen.--Gibbeynator 09:33, 15 December 2009 (EST)

Poor plan?

  • If Joseph was trying to keep Samuel from discovering that he could enhance his powers, is a carnival composed mostly of evolved humans really the best setup? Even though Samuel was unaware of this quirk, his powers were still being multiplied (and it seems unlikely that he wouldn't discover that at some point on his own when using/testing his abilities in the normal scheme of things). What was Joseph thinking ? --Stevehim 11:51, 7 December 2009 (EST)
    • Joseph always avoided making the carnival bigger than it was, he only allowed people who needed to be in it to be a part of it. Limiting the number of evolved humans was his way of keeping Samuel's power as in control as he could. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 12:08, 7 December 2009 (EST)
      • Yeah, he wanted to keep Samuel basically isolated from the world, but it's really hard to hide someone who can cause earthquakes. He chose to surround him with just enough EHs for him to blend in, but not enough to seriously affect his power. --Yamawhata? 16:47, 7 December 2009 (EST)
        • I would think it would be better to have him in a setting with no EHs around. I haven't read any current GNs, so don't know what the carnival's origins were (eg - if it was inherited by the Sullivan Bros. or something like that), but it still seems (imo) like a poor situation to set up for someone who you are trying to keep away from EHs. Other than Primatech and Coyote Sands, I don't recall as many EHs having ever been gathered in one place as far as we know (and for all we know there may even be more at the carnival than at Primatech or CS). Many of the EHs try to hide their powers from society at arge and do it without being surrounded by other EHs. I just feel that it was inevitable that Samuel would discover his true power eventually in that type of setting (even without the film, he probably still noticed/would've noticed that his power was growing...just not know why). --Stevehim 22:41, 7 December 2009 (EST)
            • The fact is that joseph wanted to be around EH's also and couldn't base his entire life around samuel. He made the carnival and kept people with abilities around, but made sure there weren't enough to turn samuel into a real threat.
              • Let's see, when Joseph was alive, there were Eli, Caleb, Damien, Arnold, Edgar, Lydia, the fortune teller, Doyle, Bo, the game operator, two unnamed guys (the ones at the Christmas table) and Joseph himself - thirteen EHs. Now there are twenty-six. I don't know, thirteen seems to me quite a big number to give Samuel's power significant boost. Green.gif AltesUTC CH 05:01, 17 December 2009 (EST)

The Wall

He wasn't mentioned, right?-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 19:12, 6 March 2010 (EST)

  • I think Samuel may have said something about or refering to him when he brought up Nathan, but I'm not 100% sure.--PJDEP - Talk - Polls and Opinions 19:14, 6 March 2010 (EST)
    • I used the search tool on my browser on the page for The Wall, I searched for Joseph but was unable to find anything.-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 19:15, 6 March 2010 (EST)
      • Samuel may have refered to him as a brother and not by name. Once again though, that's only a feeling.--PJDEP - Talk - Polls and Opinions 19:17, 6 March 2010 (EST)
        • I think that there would be atleast a link to it even if they refered him as brother, because I even searched in the edit section for the page but still no result.-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 19:19, 6 March 2010 (EST)
      • Wait, my mistake lol. I confused The Wall with Brave New World....--PJDEP - Talk - Polls and Opinions 19:20, 6 March 2010 (EST)
        • Lol, but nobody is able to confirm it here, so should we remove the section?-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 19:22, 6 March 2010 (EST)
          • Rewatched the episode quick, I'm unable to find anything about Joseph. So I'm going to remove the The Wall section.-- Yoshi | Talk | Contributions 19:30, 6 March 2010 (EST)
            • Samuel says that his brother said he could move mountains and cities. I'll add the section back in. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 20:22, 6 March 2010 (EST)