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Episode talk:Our Father

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Oh, I am not happy about this. Not at all. And this episode was going so well too.--Falcomadol 21:53, 8 December 2008 (EST)

Which part was that again? Dx Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:02, 8 December 2008 (EST)
The part where Mohindar looked like an evil underling as Arthur exposed the formula to the catalyst. They did some patching at the end, but the super soldiers bit is way too much for this show. Whoever has been writing and producing this show needs to have it taken away from them, for the good of everyone.--Falcomadol 22:04, 8 December 2008 (EST)
Hmm, "whoever has been writing and producing this show"... I believe that would be the writers and producers of Heroes. :P Mike 22:07, 8 December 2008 (EST)
Indeed, and they should all be fired. Or put in front of a firing squad. After this episode, I'm leaning towards the latter. Frankly, I'm starting to feel like an idiot for continuing to watch this season when so many other people have thrown up their hands and given up on the show. I'm wondering if there will even be any lights to turn out when I leave.--Falcomadol 22:31, 8 December 2008 (EST)
I'll turn 'em off, I'll be the last to leave the show. Dracomaster4 22:36, 8 December 2008 (EST)
Nope, I'll be the last. ;) I can't ever imagine not watching Heroes unless it was (knock on wood) canceled, or worse: if Claire or Hiro were killed off. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:38, 8 December 2008 (EST)
I'd stay even if they get killed off, so I'd be the last unless it was the Cancellation Future. Dracomaster4 22:43, 8 December 2008 (EST)
Honestley, i don't think its as bad as everyone thinks it is, i was one (if not the only) of the people that liked season 2, i mean, of course it has changed, but i think thats to be expected. Now i think the writers are kinda getting the Heroes formula back and are trying to revert back to first season, but we'll just have to see. Til then, i'm staying a Die-hard Heroes fan for life!--Anthony Gooch 22:45, 8 December 2008 (EST)
I liked season 2. Bloodbath 23:24, 8 December 2008 (EST)
I agree. I actually think season three would be the best season if it didn't have so many mini-story arcs, and if people didn't keep switching alliances so damn often. I'm not so sure what's so bad about it, other than that. And season two was easily the worst season, but it wasn't that bad by itself. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:46, 8 December 2008 (EST)
The thing is that I know I'll keep watching at least until the end of the season, but this is no longer a great show, and it's not even a good show anymore, this is a bad show, and I'm starting to watch it for the pleasure of seeing a trainwreck in action. The dialogue is bad, the characterizations are in no way consistent, the acting is bad, you don't know who's going to get killed this week, but you damn well know who ISN'T going to get killed this week, so there's no suspense. No one left from the first season is in any genuine risk anymore because they're afraid to lose the fans of X or Y character now that they've lost the mainstream. They're going to kill people every week now, but it's all new cannon fodder. The only worthwhile character they created this season was Arthur and he was obscenely overpowered to the point where they had to write him out. There are problems here, I know it, and I'm watching it anyway. Probably the worst sign is creating one-episode characters for the purpose of moving their one-use-only power to Sylar so they can have a 10 second scene. Doh! And if you count Hiro's mother, then we got TWO single serving characters this week. We've had a raftload of them this season. Black-hole-guy, metal-hand-guy, puppet-master-guy, and you can bet that super-soldier-with-no-morals-because-he's-suffering-from-PTSD-guy is going to be next week's single-serving character.--Falcomadol 22:51, 8 December 2008 (EST)
If it's any conselation, puppet master guy will be important in volume 4....--Anthony Gooch 23:16, 8 December 2008 (EST)
Also, Bryan Fuller will be returning to the show. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 23:17, 8 December 2008 (EST)
"Our Father" = Best. Episode. Ever. I loved the way Sylar killed Elle, I loved all the Hiro and Claire stuff, I loved Ando's reaction, I loved every bit of Arthur's final scene, and I love the direction the show is headed. The only boring part was the scene with Tracy and Nathan talking, but we got to see Flint and Knox haunting the hallway, so it even redeemed that part!--Mistyjo 06:55, 9 December 2008 (EST)
After checking the authors of this episode and seeing the list of other episodes they wrote (including "Homecoming" and "Angels and Monsters") I see why I liked this episode so much, these two are the best writers on the show. Did you notice not one cheesy line this week? Plus, the characters are acting more like themselves. I also appreciate the broadening of Sylar's character. He went from bad to evil, but his motives are so clear and he has managed to hold on to his humanity too. I think there's more to him not killing Peter than Peter's lack of powers. Also, before he burns Elle, he touches her, he loves her, he just loves himself more. These writers should write every episode.--Mistyjo 07:17, 9 December 2008 (EST)

I loved this episode. Technicly Peter was the one to kill Arthur: he fired that bullet, all Sylar ended up doing was letting it go letting it finish shooting Arthur in the head. Watch his hand and you'll see that all he does is lower it and not make any gestures that would indicate that he pushed that bullet along. Peter truly killed Arthur not Sylar and I liked that too. I think its about time one of the villians were killed and not just defeated and contained in some manner. Technicly Peter did kill before: he killed Future Nathan and if Future Nathan survived that, then he very likely bled to death. Also we got to see that people who have the power of regeneration can be killed for good and not just temporarily. Angela and The Haitian were right: Arthur was just too powerful and too dangerous to be left alive, he'd have easily broken out if he was just captured and it all would have started again. I would have liked a massive battle between all of the heroes and Arthur that ended with his death like in one fanfiction story where they all fought Sylar and Matt and Niki were killed before Hiro finally killed him by decapitating him (all of the villans were killed in that one: Sylar by Hiro, Elle by Sparrow, Maury by Arthur, Arthur by Adam, Adam by first Noah and then Mohinder, West (who was revealed to be really evil) by Claire, Angela by Ando, Sparrow by Noah and Bob by Claude) and then they later fought Sparrow who in that story had a combination of Linda Tavara and Arthur's absorbtion powers (she stole people's powers like Arthur but it killed them like Linda) and was finally killed by Noah who shot her in the head. Those are the sort of things that make shows interesting: a good battle that ends with the death of the villian. Although I suppose Arthur was just too powerful for that even if Peter (if he still had his powers) and Sylar teamed up to fight him. I guess assination was the only real way to kill him. If Arthur could be killed like that, then that means shooting Sylar in the head or decapitating him should finally kill him. Of course that will be difficult to do. From what they showed of Elle's body though, I think Sylar just cut her head open to kill her, not to gain her powers. He seemed to regret what he did though.--WarGrowlmon18 10:22, 9 December 2008 (EST)

  • The Great Wall of Text hammers my brain. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 11:21, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • "Technicly Peter was the one to kill Arthur: he fired that bullet, all Sylar ended up doing was letting it go letting it finish shooting Arthur in the head." - I disagree. Remember, Sylar doesn't have any powers to freeze time or anything like that. The only way he could've stopped that bullet was to use Telekinesis and stop it entirely. That would remove all momentum from the bullet and mean that as soon as he stopped holding it there, it would simply drop to the ground and be completely harmless. In order for it to hit Arthur, he would have to actively propel it back along it's path. So though Peter did make an honest attempt to kill his father (and so from a psychological standpoint, he may as well have done so), Sylar prevented it from happening, and then killed Arthur himself instead. --Maelwys 11:55, 9 December 2008 (EST)
    • As a note, in this week's graphic novel, Arthur seems satisfied that Peter is responsible for his death. Also note that the bullet is spinning as it hovers in front of Arthur: something it wouldn't do if Sylar was stopping it telekinetically. Of course, it wouldn't really spin no matter what was going on... --Gadfly 12:01, 9 December 2008 (EST)
      • The way it was spinning like that indicate Sylar probably just held it enough with telekinesis to stop it from going any futher, but didn't take it all away. If you watch Sylar, all he does is drop his hand and let go, he makes no hand motions that indicate he flung it into Arthur.--WarGrowlmon18 13:41, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • What are you talking about? A formula that gives soldiers superhuman abilities? That's totally original! I'm amazed at the writer's creativity! --Hero!(talk)(contribs) 14:10, 9 December 2008 (EST)
      • "Technicly Peter was the one to kill Arthur: he fired that bullet, all Sylar ended up doing was letting it go letting it finish shooting Arthur in the head." - Disagree. Peter pulled the trigger proving he could do what was needed. Events changed during the bullets path because Sylar used telekinesis on the bullet. At this time, the bullet was in control by Sylar, even though Peter intended to kill his father, he did not (he only proved he was capable of doing so). Sylar could've dropped the bullet to the ground, or changed it's trajectory. It was Sylars decision to make the bullet continue and kill Arthur which is why it makes perfect sense when Sylar told Peter "You're not a killer, but I am". Sylar killed Arthur. --Denali 14:39, 9 December 2008 (EST)
      • "As a note, in this week's graphic novel, Arthur seems satisfied that Peter is responsible for his death." I agree Arthur felt proud but disagree why. It wasn't for responsibility for his death since Peter didn't cause it; moreover, Arthur said, "I'm proud he pulled the trigger...Peter proved me wrong." By pulling the trigger, Peter showed Arthur that he is strong enough to do what needs to be done, that's why he said it's the best feeling in the world. --Denali 14:39, 9 December 2008 (EST)

Kinda fun to see how different ppl's opinions are on this episode :) Personally, I think that it was the best episode since season 1 - especially the director, the photographer and the editors did some stunning work! Jack Coleman, Zachary Quinto, Jimmy Jean-Louis and Ashley Crow did some of their best performances so far (save Coleman in "Company Man"). It was a treat to see Tamlyn Tomita and Chad Faust. For the first time in years (or even ever) I found Hiro as endearing as people claim he is (and his cliffhanger (façadehanger?) was also great) . The scenes with Claire & Noah, Hiro & Ishi, Peter & Arthur, Nathan & Tracy and pretty much everything with Sylar were absolute series highlights. The Sue Landers scenes might even reach my top three of Heroes moments. Angela did what she does best - ice cold commanding. Ando, Matt and Daphne makes a terrific trio. And the super soldiers story really appeal to me so far. Now - if only the writers could be more consistent (in pretty much every aspect) I would be nothing but smiling :) --Pierre 20:24, 9 December 2008 (EST)

  • I'm not happy about the turns that are made in the show. This episode proved again that it's missing something. Looking back at 3x01 till 3x03 this season was so promising and I was all into the whole where did Tracy come from. But the answer was SOOO BORING, well tracy you were part of a stolen triplet by a lame-1-time-introduced character and was used for experimentation :S how lame. What is happening to Mohinder was so cool and with Maya as well, but then we got an answer, and it was SOOO BORING. I thought he was getting a animal/primal senses ability when he walked up the wall but now he is just some sort of weird lizard thing who does weird experiments and is now a slave to Arthur who is boring and sort of on the wrong side. His character is all screwed up now. Just to verify I am 100% a fan and I LOVE THIS SHOW from S1 till S3x03 but now I'm really getting annoyed by some episodes that are so plain stupid. I liked Mohinder being in controle and doing justice things (with the guys on the dock) all by himself for once. I liked the Jeckyll & Hyde aspect. But all that wonderfullness went down the drain when he went all dr psycho and harmed Maya his storyline is taking way to long it's boring now. Let's talk about Elle I hate that she is killed and now even BURNED... seriously? She's a fan favourte, at least every heroes fan I talk with seems to thinks so. But after Villains her character became so stupid and used. The relationship with Sylar was too rushed in that Primatech cell and the way she got killed off without a good reason really annoyed me. Hi I'm Sylar and dayovernight I change my mind again and think I want to be a killer after all, and hey let's kill Elle hello STUUUPID, why did he kill Elle in the process? All examples of the show still missing something. The Eclipse seemed to bring some glory back but now with Our Father .. lamee I liked the whole episode until Arthur came back in time and Sylar was on a killing spree. And don't get me started on the Catalyst. Okay I'm starting... the catalyst seemed a cool thing, something ancient something that is connected to the very first cell that created abilities to the first person something primal. Something so old that it is like carved into piramides. I was like finaly we get something that is linked to the Helix and we get to know it's origins. But it turned out to be some unrealistic (even for heroes) kind of "Light" thingie. I dunno I just thought it was just too much even for the show. This show is missing something, and I think I know what it is. The storylines are just not-relatable anymore. Sure it's about extraordinary people experiencing some ordinary events, but the things they deal with now are just too much out of the ordinary .. too big, and way too rushed. Sure it's Heroes and it's sci-fi but what we could do in the first season we can't do in the second one and now the third anymore. And that is relating to the characters. I'm really hoping all the characters turn back to there old selves again, but with the experience of S2 and S3.1. I'm not saying Claire should go back chearleading, but I do think Peter should have his ability back and just be himself like he was at the end of S2 and the flashback episode of Season 2 "Four Months Ago...". Anyone of you agree on some terms with me. I'm sure there are other things I didn't like so far in S3 but let me spare you those. DarthYotho 16:09, 10 December 2008 (EST)
    • Ok, I'm going to voice my opinion on Season 3 now. I've been one of those fans who never really hated anything they've done with the show, but even I sort of lost some interest in the middle. Like DarthYoho hinted at somewhere in that brick of text, the show's characters have become unrelatable, and the series has taken a turn towards comic bookesque plots. However, I get the gist of the season, and what it's point kind of is. It's difficult to connect because all of the characters are dealing on a higher plane of issues than most of us. Even the nonpowered characters are dealing with supernatural, fate of the world sized conflicts. The whole time this is happening, our character's moralities have been tested and muddled by various influences. Our beacon of hope, Hiro, dabbled in his darker side, just as our serial killer Sylar tried to reform. This is obvious to alienate some of the fanbase because not everybody's going to enjoy that. However, with Our Father, we see these evolutions coming full circle. Hiro seems redeemed after Sam's pep talk (which summarized Hiro's role in the show perfectly) and his touching reunion with his mother, Sylar has cast aside all hope of redemption and returned to his comfortable insanity. We even see characters like Peter and Nathan returning to the kind of characters they were in Season One. Peter still has his innocence, Nathan has his (inherited) darker utilitarianism, and HRG is the morally gray Company Man. But besides bringing our characters back to a similar state as Season One (with all the experience they've gained since), the story has taken an interesting turn. While I understand that Captain America fans might have groaned at the super soldier development, I saw a good reinterpretation. If you all think the first season was without a comic comparison, go be literate and read Watchmen. It's probably the best graphic novel ever written and it was a great place for Heroes to draw some inspiration from. While Heroes isn't original, it's a flagship in a movement that's sweeping America: to take superhero stories and make them plausible and relevant (go watch Iron Man or Dark Knight and TRY to disagree with me). It's not original, but that's fine. It's a television show. But once again, the show is showing the ability for superpowers to be an object of philosophical interest. Nathan's speech at the end of The Eclipse Part II was amazingly written in my opinion, and it's setting the tone for Fugitives. Nathan has revealed himself to be the leader of a new future, one which will (literally?) split the world in two. On a side note, go watch Five Years Gone and think about how different the world's shaping to be. Not much. Nathan as president, Mohinder as his scientific lapdog, with heroes on the run from the government. I know it's broad, but I love how no matter how much tweaking the show does with the future and past, they seem to be building towards one central future. Ok, my ocean of text is done. If you read this, you're a champ. --Cairoi 18:44, 10 December 2008 (EST)
      • Only this has zero chance of going anywhere near the direction of a Captain America character. This guy is pretty obviously going to be evil. He's the antithesis of Captain America, he's given super powers, and Captain America is the epitome of what humanity can be without becoming super-human (he's got no special abilities, he basically just got a steroid injection and works out a lot). The show is very definitely going in the DC direction, or maybe X-Men (if you feel like staying in Marvel), where there's just a massive proliferation of useless characters who show up, do their thing, and disappear again. The show started out with a lot of that Marvel (specifically MarvelS) spirit, normal people dealing with real human problems. It's lost that completely.--Falcomadol 13:47, 11 December 2008 (EST)
Okay, so Sylar tells Peter he doesn't have anything he needs anymore. But what about The Haitian is nackered standing beside Peter? Imagine how powerful Sylar would be if he had The Haitian's power? Anyway, that would be total over-the-top. Also, doesn't Arthur have regeneration from that 5000 year old man? I though the Haitian got super tired and his powers stopped (because Arthur was able to scratch Peter's face). Unless the Haitian recovered and both Haitian and Sylar worked together to stop Arthur. So technically, Arthur could still live if someone took the bullet out of his head (just like what happened to Claire many times with pipe objects, etc). ----Andrewwan1980 08:44, 11 December 2008 (EST)
Adam wasn't nearly 5000 yrs old, but we get what you mean (Takezo Kenzei was born 1584). The Haitians powers didn't stop, it was weakened. We don't know how the Haitians abilities work on someone who has multiple abilites like Arthur. Maybe he was focusing more on negating his regen ability moreso than the telekinesis. --Denali 09:12, 11 December 2008 (EST)
Arthur stayed dead after the Haitian left the room to go after Sylar at Peter's command, it's been said more than once that damage to the brain can kill a regenerator, and know it's been proved. Claire and Peter have died before, and only came back after the thing in their brains was removed, the bullet must still be in Arthur's brain. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 09:59, 11 December 2008 (EST)
My comment- I think they really destroyed Sylar's character. His sudden killer outburst is so unlikely as his sudden redemption. This "hunger" story is completely idiot: Sylar does what he does because he's a psycho, not because he's forced to. And, if Elle was so important to him to the point of driving him to killing again, like Villains showed, why he would just kill her? He already had her powers. And Tracy, too. One minute, she's killing herself because she killed some random reporter. The other, she goes to Arthur's side and runs to get an army! She recovered real fast, didn't she? And poor Mohinder. I'm okay with his characterization, I just wish they hadn't done that with him. At least, Arthur is not Sylar's father. I think even Season Two is best than Season Three... but, of course, I'll keep watching. Scarlet Girl - Talk - December 12, 2008, Brazil.
Sylar killed Elle because she lied to him. When Bennett was telling him Arthur and Angela weren't his real parents, Elle said not to listen, he was just trying to get under his skin. Obviously she would've known from reading his files, like Bennett said. (PS, this is my first comment/post on HeroesWiki so I hope I didn't screw it up!)--Jessica13 16:15, 12 December 2008 (EST)

Arthur/Lead Image

What a shame. He was a pretty good villain. I wish he stuck around at least until the volume finale... meh.

Also, my suggestion for the lead image is the bullet hovering in front of Arthur's face. Just my two cents. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:14, 8 December 2008 (EST)

  • I, personally, like him laying dead on the carpet, but i think either/or would do the job!--Anthony Gooch 22:24, 8 December 2008 (EST)
    • I dunno, that image seems too spoilery for the purposes of introducing a synopsis. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:44, 8 December 2008 (EST)
      • Agreed, with the bullet image, you kinda know it's stopped, one could think it was Arthur holding it there, but with the carpet painting job picture...that leaves nothing to chance. Dracomaster4 22:46, 8 December 2008 (EST)
      • Point taken, ok, what about the fire burning in Sylar's eyes at the beach?...or should we stick with "fatherly" things, b/c of the title?--Anthony Gooch 22:47, 8 December 2008 (EST)
        • Or maybe a shot of when Noah was staring in silence (almost lovingly) at Claire, at the end of their conversation. Mike 22:53, 8 December 2008 (EST)
          • Nah, we had a Bennet last week, i don't think they should get the honor 2 weeks on a row lol--Anthony Gooch 23:17, 8 December 2008 (EST)
  • Any picture of Arthur should work, other than the one with him head on the ground. Bloodbath 23:20, 8 December 2008 (EST)


Oh gosh, here we go again. Sue Landers' ability looks to be a fun one to discuss! :D Her scene with Sylar was so cool, although admittedly at first I wondered why Sarah Palin was on Heroes.--Crazylicious 22:22, 8 December 2008 (EST)

Haha, when I first saw here, that was exactly what I thought - she looked like Sarah Palin. Anyway, I made pages for Sue Landers and her ability. Mike 22:27, 8 December 2008 (EST)
  • So i guess it safe to speak for everyone and call her ability Lie detection....unless someone wants to add "super-human-mental-falsehood readings" or "Sue's ability" to the ballott, lol :D--Anthony Gooch 22:30, 8 December 2008 (EST)
    • "super-human-mental-falsehood readings" -- THIS.--Crazylicious 22:32, 8 December 2008 (EST)


I just have to say, the makeup artists did a really good job at making Claire;s mom look younger--Cairoi 22:47, 8 December 2008 (EST)

  • I thought the same thing! I picked up on that instantly and was like, "Wow! They did an amazing job!" (Admin 22:56, 8 December 2008 (EST))
    • Same here, although, I wonder if they used the same technique as the opening scene of X-men 3. Dracomaster4 23:04, 8 December 2008 (EST)
      • Thought the same exact thing. :O--Riddler 23:11, 8 December 2008 (EST)
        • What do you mean? I haven't seen the X men films.--Cairoi 23:17, 8 December 2008 (EST)
          • They just made Ian McKeller X, look younger, like botox, only without the facial poisoning! lol--Anthony Gooch 23:27, 8 December 2008 (EST)
          • They used personal photographs from the actors possession and used it as a reference for digital regression of aging, here's a link with pictures. Dracomaster4 23:35, 8 December 2008 (EST)
            • That's really cool! If only they did that for George Takei in 1977... no offense to Eijiro Ozaki, but he looks nothing like George... Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 23:39, 8 December 2008 (EST)
              • Yeah, I actually thought of it when I saw that episode, was a little disappointed they couldnt find someone who looks like George. Dracomaster4 00:07, 9 December 2008 (EST)
        • I really thought it was a different actor LOL --NiveKJ13 (talk2me) 10:43, 9 December 2008 (EST)

The time line?

So now that Hiro went back in time and took the catalyst from his mother, what does that say for the events in the time line this season that all involved Claire being the catalyst? Like when Sylar said that Claire was different and special when looking at her brain, and when Hiro's father made the tape telling Hiro to gaurd the formula and that there is someone out there with "the light" in them (the catalyst, Claire). Now that they made it so that Claire isn't the catalyst anymore did all these events even happen, or did the time line kind of loop around those people involved in the events, kind of like what happend with Ando in season one when Hiro went back in time to save Charlie, where Ando still recalled Hiro never knowing knowing Charlie in the past but everyone who worked at the Burnt Toast Diner remembered Hiro form the past? I bet what I said didn't even make any seance to any of you, haha sorry I'm trying to be as clear as possible.--Cairoi 23:03, 8 December 2008 (EST)

  • I'm thinking what Claire said will make Noah guard her this time around, and if Kaito found Ishi dead in the chair, he's most definately make a tape telling Hiro to find it, because now he has no idea who has the catalyst. Dracomaster4 23:05, 8 December 2008 (EST)
    • Yeah thats what I'm so confused about, Why would he even bother making a tape if the catalyst is lost, unless he knows someone took it form her and the catalyst is still out there somewhere. --Cairoi 23:09, 8 December 2008 (EST)
    • Theory: Kaito finds Ishi dead. He knows she's given up "The light", and he knows she wanted to give it to Hiro. He knows Hiro has it now, and keeps it a secret just like Claire. Either way, all of that stays the same. --Riddler 23:11, 8 December 2008 (EST)
      • So then what's so special about Claire? Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 23:12, 8 December 2008 (EST)
        • Exactly. But even if your theory is right Riddler, do you this the writers will even bother to explain this, or will the just let it go?--Cairoi 23:14, 8 December 2008 (EST)
          • My 2p is that with time travel I always just assume that events in the past will end up turning into a predestination paradox (i.e. the past hasn't changed at all because the present only exists thanks to the time travel) unless the present is noticeably changed. In this case that would mean that the catalyst has always been in the present which would still leave the problem of what Kaito thought had happened to it, unless he assumed that Ishi had given it to young Hiro--NichS 21:36, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • Remember, in this timeline we dont "know" that Claire was the catalyst, only that everyone assumed so. Sylar only said that she was special, that could be something entirely different from the catalyst. Perhaps Hiro was the catalyst all along. TexasHays 23:21, 8 December 2008 (EST)
    • Good point, we only assumed Clare was the catalyst b/c Claire said, "I think, i'm the catalyst", but what does she know, this is the girl that stuck her fingers in the garbage disposal...--Anthony Gooch 23:25, 8 December 2008 (EST)
      • Even if Sylar didn't tell Claire that, he likely still left her alive. My guess is Kaito is the one who rescues Hiro from falling and Hiro explains who he is.
        • The problem is you guys are saying maybe Hiro had it all along to solve any problems in the timeline... but he didnt have it all along either way, because Arthur took it. If anything, Arthur had always taken the Catalyst at that point, and it had been lost for 16 years. But that doesnt explain the special claire comment by Sylar. Id say events changed. --Action Figure 00:23, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • Oh, not to mention the fact that Ishi Nakamura was buried in 1990 and died in 1992 V_V --Action Figure 10:35, 9 December 2008 (EST)
    • Our Father's time-travel scenes occur roughly "16 years" before ~April 2007, so that could be late 1990 (hard to imagine how it's '92). It's concurrent with the Company Man flashback set "14 years" before October 2006 (presumably just late 1991 and any of 1992). Really, at this point, I'd hazard to guess that Hiro was incorrectly estimating his mother's funeral's date in Cautionary Tales ("It's 17 years ago") and it occurred November-December 1991 (almost 15 years before Company Man, 15 years 4-5 months before Our Father, and 15 years 3-4 months before Cautionary Tales).--Tim Thomason 19:47, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • The timeline is how it has always been. There is no confirmation that Clair ever was the catalyst, simply special. Hiro's father was never specific on who the catalyst was either, perhaps because he was unaware of it, and simply new that the catalyst was no longer within his wife. Lastly, for sixteen years the catalyst has been non-existent, no body had it during that time. Because an 'adult' Hiro from the present took it from his mother sixteen years ago, and then Arthur from the present took it from Hiro sixteen years ago and brought it to the present. --Feral
    • Where better to hide the catalyst than in the future? Unfortunately he didn't quite reckon with Arthur's abilities.--Falcomadol 13:51, 11 December 2008 (EST)

Why not Hiro's sister?

I get that Hiro's dad didn't want to give the catalyst to Hiro because he didn't have faith in him, but why not give it to Hiro's sister? I mean Hiro's mom siad she wanted to keep it in the family right? Maybe its because shes a girl, after all he did have a problem with letting her be the head of his company or what ever it was, in season one. Maybe the catalyst can only be held by someone with a power and she may not have one. Or maybe the writers have just completely forgotten about her character. What do you think?--Cairoi 23:26, 8 December 2008 (EST)

  • Hiro's sister is likely in Japan and Kaito was likely worried there wasn't time enough to track her down and get her to the USA before she would die.--MiamiVolts (talk) 23:49, 8 December 2008 (EST)
  • Plus they may have known that Hiro had powers (even if not sure what) and she didn't. They seemed to want to make sure someone with powers had it, thus Kaito's interest in Claire as the "perfect place." --Gadfly 23:53, 8 December 2008 (EST)


Anyone catch the names on Elle's cellphone? I saw Sparrow Redhouse. Nice touch, props department. I'm also betting the cell was a Sprint phone doubling as a blatant product placement. As long as I'm on the subject of phone contacts, I gotta say that Sylar preparing to kill Sue's party guests and saying "Mmm... cake" was the most epic Heroes line ever, ince itmade me remnisce on the golden days when we thought Sylar ate the brains. Yay! Kortu 00:09, 9 December 2008 (EST)

  • Elle's contacts list.jpg --HiroDynoSlayer (talk) 12/9/2008 00:32 (EST)
    • That's not all the names. Sylar scrolled a bit more. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 01:15, 9 December 2008 (EST)
      • Yes it is; I merged three frames together into one for the shot so they'd all show. :) --HiroDynoSlayer (talk) 12/9/2008 01:17 (EST)
      • Haha, "ellephone". I got the numbers written down to put on the character pages. I don't think Melvin Crum has a page yet, but his number was listed as 617-555-0145. Also, they misspelled Curtis's last name.--Piemanmoo 01:30, 9 December 2008 (EST)
        • By "they", you mean Elle misspelled Curtis's last name, right? Must be the blonde in her ;) jk. --Denali 13:08, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • I Think that maybe Elle's phone can have his own article. After all, we don't know if this is a extract of the Chandra's list or another list made by Elle. User:ArgentinaSeeHeroes December 13.

You don't have anything that I want

Of course Peter didn't have any powers that Sylar wanted, but what about The Haitian? Wouldn't his power be extremely helpful? It would have been easy to take it since Haitian was worn out from restraining Arthur. Bloodbath 00:29, 9 December 2008 (EST)

  • I think Sylar wants what's in the next room even more than the Haitian's ability; also, with Arthur dead, the Haitian could more easily fight Sylar off and block his abilities.--MiamiVolts (talk) 04:06, 9 December 2008 (EST)
    • What was in the next room? Nathan, Tracy, Mohinder and the formula, all of which he could take while drugged after getting the Haitian's ability. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 07:28, 9 December 2008 (EST)
      • I dont know, even after being exhausted holding back Arthur, the Haitian didn't seem too reluctant to chase Sylar immediately afterwards. Peter wouldn't have told the Haitian to go after Sylar if he didn't think the Haitian could defend himself anymore. --Denali 13:13, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • Don't have anything I want - what about Arthur? His head would be swimming with abilities, including time travel which Sylar hasnt yet acquired.
    • "what about Arthur? His head would be swimming with abilities..." - Who said that?? Please sign your post, thanks. Arthur took a bullet square in the forehead, his brain probably received massive trauma, maybe Sylar could pick up all the brain matter and put it back together like a watch and then figure out the abilities but I highly doubt it, nor would Peter/Haitian allow it right in front of them. --Denali 09:06, 10 December 2008 (EST)
      • Sort of off-topic, but when I saw this, all I could think of was Sylar: [1]--Falcomadol 13:38, 11 December 2008 (EST)
  • When Sylar said that, it really made me think of this one episode of the show "Justice League". The Justice League is attacked by a robot, AMAZO, that can copy their powers, and eventually he becomes so powerful that he deems himself above their petty squabbles. He takes off to go explore the universe and to continue evolving. Sylar's line at the end of the episode made me wonder if the writers would try taking his character in that sort of direction. What if Sylar soon becomes so powerful that he transcends good and evil?--Plaxmax 22:14, 14 December 2008 (EST)

Next week's episode?

"Duel"? Or "Duality"? "Duel" is currently listed... --Gadfly 23:50, 8 December 2008 (EST)

  • Please identify yourself by adding a signature. The name Duel was announced in a recent spoiler.--MiamiVolts (talk) 04:03, 9 December 2008 (EST)
    • Do you mean the "Next week on Heroes" box on the main page, i changed that to Duel last night...but i'm not sure if this is what you are asking about--Anthony Gooch 09:21, 9 December 2008 (EST)

is there something else on this page that refers to next week's episode? :) But yes, a few sources list "Duality" as the title. --Gadfly 09:58, 9 December 2008 (EST) So now it's "Dual... --Gadfly 15:09, 15 December 2008 (EST)

Hiro vs Hiro?

I'm not pretty sure about this... but in the Duel preview I saw two guys and one with a sword... and they look like Hiro! what do you think?

  • no when i saw it, it looked like ando against hiro.Gabriel Bishop 13:50, 9 December 2008 (EST) Gabriel Bishop
  • It was Kaito against a defenseless Hiro! --Action Figure 17:47, 9 December 2008 (EST)
  • It was Kaito versus Hiro holding some french bread as a sword. I saw it in a promo picture for the episode. Mike 17:53, 9 December 2008 (EST)

Daphne's Power?

Daphne can take people much too large for her to carry with her while she moves at super-speed. Is there precedent for this, or is the the first time we've seen it? (p.s. first time poster, hope I'm doing this right) --Robzen 13:45, 9 December 2008 (EST)

She carried Flint when she broke him out of Level 5. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 13:51, 9 December 2008 (EST)
Ah, of course. Thanks. --Robzen 14:03, 9 December 2008 (EST)
Maybe the same way Nathan carries people hundreds of miles... --Dumpster juice 17:53, 9 December 2008 (EST)
Yea, but even that has its limits. Remeber how 'unpleasant' he made it sound when he had to carry parkman? Thelink 12:50, 13 December 2008 (EST)

I don't get how Arthur...

Don't get how Arthur went back in time to take the catalyst from Hiro, if he went back in time before he took Hiro's powers. Am I missing somthign here :/? - Mike N. 14:34, 9 December 2008 (EST)

  • Peter had Hiro's power before Arthur stole it. Arthur had access to Peter's lightning, a mimicked ability, and thusly Arthur had access to Hiro's ability. --SacValleyDweller (talk) 14:41, 9 December 2008 (EST)
    • Oh, so he just took Hiro's power to make him powerless.. i got it :) - Mike N. 14:48, 9 December 2008 (EST)
      • Have you not been paying attention recently: Arthur teleported to and from Africa. How do you think he did that??? The power of imagination??? He used Peter's copy of Hiro's power Dumbo!!!!!!! --WarGrowlmon18 14:58, December 9, 2008
        • Hi mystery person above me. The dumb ones are actually easiest to spot on a wiki because they are the ones who dont sign comments... Action Figure 15:39, 9 December 2008 (EST)
          • Lol actually i am dumb but i thought he just went on a plane to africa... w/e :/ - Mike N. 15:41, 9 December 2008 (EST)
          • They're also the ones who don't sign comments even after being told several times how to do so... with pictures. But Mike, don't worry about it. If you missed the part where Arthur teleported back to Pinehearst from Africa, then that's an understandable assumption to make, since we never saw him teleport to Africa in the first place. No worries! Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 09:41, 10 December 2008 (EST)
        • WarGrowlmon18, please remain civil. Thank you. (Admin 15:42, 9 December 2008 (EST))
          • And thanks for signing your comment ;) --Action Figure 17:46, 9 December 2008 (EST)
        • Wargrowl18 - The point of the wiki is for people to come and ask questions, get clarification and enjoy the Heroes experience. There is no need for insulting comments and/or name calling. Nobody wants any of that here. --Denali 09:14, 10 December 2008 (EST)
I don't get how Arthur knew when & where to get Hiro. Maybe a butterfly effect happened after Hiro got the light. In the present day the company knew that the light was not in Claire anymore... but how Arthur knew it was in present day Hiro is beyond me. Arthur originally did not know who had the light but I believe he needs to use precog to see whoever has it now. ----Andrewwan1980 07:48, 11 December 2008 (EST)
  • I wondered the same thing, i asked it on Catalyst discussion. Also, it would have made sense for Arthur to teleport to the past and take the catalyst from a helpless baby Claire or sick Ishi. The only explanation is to make a dramatic story. :)--Onehardrocker 23:05, 11 December 2008 (EST)
    • Actually, I think arthur may have used some intuitive reasoning and possibly his precog abilities to find hiro and claire. Remember, when Arthur calls sylar (on the ellephone) and asks him where he is/the catalyst, Sylar says 'gone into thin air'. Arthur's not an idiot; he probably realized that an S-T manipulator (obviously hiro) had intervened. It was then just a matter of him figuring out when, which he probably deduced from reading some key primatech files or something. He DID used to be a pretty high-up in the original company, did he not? If not through the files, then perhaps he drew the same thing isaac did for 9th wonders! : ie, claire and hiro in the window.Thelink 12:55, 13 December 2008 (EST)
      • Or, he could just have known when Kaito supposedly gave Claire to Noah (no doubt they have files on the exchange, especially since Claire was meant to be an assignment) and timetraveled to that day. Simple, really. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 16:05, 13 December 2008 (EST)

Hiro protects light for 2 minutes

I was so happy for Hiro to get his act together, and at the same time become the protector of the catalyst. But then Author appears out of thin air and takes it. I thought Hiro was done failing, especially after the Seth Green hero speech, and him getting his memory back. And now there is going to be a ridiculous side story where Matt, Ando, and Daphne seek to save Hiro from time. But insead of them going to Primatech and searching through files to find a time traveler, the plan get the formula and inject Ando with it. I say don't bother. As far as im concern he never saved the world. He didn't kill sylar, because he survived; he wasn't the one who flew peter to the sky, that was Nathan. He essential created the next evil villein Adam. And although lock him away, he wasn't the one who stop the virus from hitting the floor, that was peter. Whats the point of Hiro? --WOlf 11:55, 11 December 2008 (EST)

  • "He's so cute and funny". No... That really annoyed me. Cause I like Hiro but if they are just going to keep him as a failure and comic-relief. Then I think they should kill him off. Sure, be funny and say crazy things as "yatta" and "waffles".. but at least make some difference in the show. /Larvig 21:31, 14 December 2008 (EST)


I noticed that both Ishi and Kaito referred to Noah as "Noah Bennet". according to the timeline, Noah's surname was Butler, not Bennet. Plothole?--Gabriel 12:45, 11 December 2008 (EST)

Butler was just the name he and his family took in season 2 to protect themselves from The Company. His real name is Noah Bennet.--WarGrowlmon18 12:50, 11 December 2008 (EST)
The Butlers were a family that was "attacked" by Howard Grigsby in one of the Graphic Novels, Noah and the Haitian saved them. --S3phir0th- 13:12, 13 December 2008 (EST)


" I like teleporting better. Less windy"

   - Ando (referring to Daphne's super speed) 

Is there confirmation this was Ando? I distinctly remember it being Matt that said this.--Crazylicious 18:41, 9 December 2008 (EST)

No, it was definitely Ando who said it. It is the sort of thing Matt would say though... --Gothzilla 21:52, 9 December 2008 (EST)

" It does kind of tingle."

   - Sylar (referring to his fist use of Lie Detection)

I think this should be added. I thought it was the funniest line in the episode.--Onehardrocker 23:09, 11 December 2008 (EST)

New actors and characters


That's a whole bunch, isn't it! I'll work on images after dinner. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 19:25, 9 December 2008 (EST)

  • A few of those have spoiler pages that can now be converted. I've marked them as so such that no one such mistakenly duplicates the work (though it does kind of mess up your template format, sorry).--MiamiVolts (talk) 19:36, 9 December 2008 (EST)
    • I think they're all converted now, more or less.
      • Made party guest articles. Pictures would be appreciated. - Tristan0709 20:49, 9 December 2008 (EST)

Just out of curiosity, is there some reason the credited on-screen names aren't used for these? For instance, Ewan Chung is credited here as "Sue's Office Mate" but on-screen he is credited as Office Worker #4. Granted, the former is more aesthetically pleasing, but we don't even know if he worked in the same office, or was visiting, or what. Wouldn't "Elevator Passenger" be more informative and less speculative? --Gadfly 09:55, 10 December 2008 (EST)

  • Aesthetics is the main reason. I have no problem using "office worker (I)", "officer worker (II)", etc. but the party guest route was already being used before I got to it. We can go through and change links a bit if you want...but I do think that saying "male party guest" is a bit more descriptive than "office worker (what number was he again?)". Also, the elevator guy played by Ewan Chung was in the same office as Sue--she walked by him in the first shot of the office. You can see him in this picture (though the actual moving scene identifies him a bit better). -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 10:20, 10 December 2008 (EST)
    • I'm not sure how to change links, and I didn't want to get into a back-and-forth of changing/rechanging with someone regardless. It just seems odd and a little confusing to not go with the "official" (i.e., credited) names. --Gadfly 12:59, 10 December 2008 (EST)
      • I'm not "tied" to the names that are assigned. I think I came up with "Sue's office mate", and I used the "male party guest" format that somebody else came up with. But if you thing they should be changed, you can certainly move the pages (there's a tab/link that says "move" at the top of Sue's office mate which you can use--if you would like me to explain more, just let me know at my talk page and I'd be more than willing to show you how) or add {{rename}} to the top of any pages that you think should have different names (I can give you more of an explanation than that if you need)--that way people will know that the pages are being nominated for a rename. But sometimes the "official" name in the credits is not the best or most accurate name. For instance, Link Baker was officially credited as Broken Nose, which doesn't make a whole lot of sense as a name for a person. We changed it to the more aesthetically pleasing and easier-to-work-into-an-edit broken nose guard. When HD revealed the name on his name tag, we moved the page to Officer Smith. That's just one example. In the cast of the recent few office workers, "Office worker (I)" would suffice just fine, but it's not very descriptive. One might think it's somebody who works at Yamagato Industries or another office building. "Sue's office mate" is a bit more descriptive and defines the character a little better, in my opinion. But like I said, I'm not tied to it, and am not offended if it's changed. :) -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 21:53, 10 December 2008 (EST)

Arthur glowing

  • Just after he died, Arthur glowed a bright yellowy colour. Anyone have any ideas as to why? Maybe it's obvious, and I'm being thick, but I thought it was worth mentioning...--  Lost Soul   talk  contribs  15:30, 11 December 2008 (EST)
    • I think it's supposed to be the catalyst leaving his body. Bloodbath 16:18, 11 December 2008 (EST)
      • IAWPT --onehardrocker 23:26, 11 December 2008 (EST)
        • AAUVC Bloodbath 14:31, 12 December 2008 (EST)
          • IDKMYBFFJILL Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 22:43, 12 December 2008 (EST)
            • HUH? - Tristan0709 23:06, 12 December 2008 (EST)
              • I think this would have been far less funny if Onehardrocker had gotten his acronym right in the first place :) --Falcomadol 00:33, 13 December 2008 (EST)
                • AAUVC=Acronyms are usually very confusing. I made that up when I posted it, but i'm sure it has been used before. :P
                  • It actually hasn't. I tried looking it up on Google but absolutely nothing came up. Your acronym was very confusing. Sincerely, Thrashmeister [ U | T | C ] 20:37, 13 December 2008 (EST)
  • I think its suppose to be, I Agree With This the PT the wrong way around...--NiveKJ13 (talk2me) 20:43, 13 December 2008 (EST)
    • I, too, was confused. For the future, IDNAWPTAOA (I Do Not Agree With Posts That Are Only Acronyms). As far as the light glowing, it was the catalyst or "light" as they call it. --Denali 13:59, 15 December 2008 (EST)

End of volume 3

I'm just wondering if this season will end with Sylar dying... like season 1 and 2 :] --Themd 01:43, 14 December 2008

  • Sylar didn't die at the end of season 2. He was reborn, in a sense. --Stevehim 21:04, 13 December 2008 (EST)
  • I don't know, he just died a few episodes ago. Bloodbath 23:34, 14 December 2008 (EST)
    • Well, there's your answer. Corpus Delicti--Falcomadol 15:01, 16 December 2008 (EST)


shouldnt the quote "cake?" be in the memorable quotes...thats definitely memorable...


Does anyone else notice anything about Noah's and Sandra's apartment 16 years ago? Doesn't it kind of look like Peter's apartment from season 1? It has been bothering me so please, someone tell me if i am wrong or not. --Catalyst 14:41 21 January 2009

Maybe they used the same set? I remember reading that the Wandering Rocks pub and Mohinder's lab/Isaac's loft are the same set with different decoration. Intuitive Empath - Talk - Contributions 18:50, 21 January 2009 (EST)
They are the same set. In season 2 Bob set up Mohinder with Isaac's loft so he could use it as a lap.--OutbackZack 14:34, 23 February 2009 (EST)
I have had the same question as you. It looks very much like Peter's apartment, but with different colors on the walls. --Tacroy 02:17, 28 February 2009


What car does Peter and The Haitian drive ? Its been really bugging me :p Gabriel Bishop 19:04, 9 May 2009 (EDT)

Don't know why. And what's ":p" mean?--ERROR 18:37, 12 June 2009 (EDT)

  • its a face, a guy sticking his toungue out. --Skullman1392 20:09, 12 June 2009 (EDT)

A couple of trivia questions?

The bit at the bottom of the trivia mentions the absence of Claude and Thompson, but if memory serves correctly, Claude and Thompson were in the outhouse behind younger Hiro. There would be no point in showing them in this timeline and would just be reusing old footage.

Secondly, I wish to ask if this piece of information is Trivia worthy. When Peter confronts Arthur and Arthur tries to TK the gun away, Peter tilts his head. As he does so, the Haitian appears from behind a wall and you can hear the sound of wind chimes which we know are in some way connected to the Haitian. Is this worth a mention in the trivia section? --mc_hammark 15:17, 31 August 2009 (EDT)